March 24, 2006
-
World Involvement
A case that was getting a lot of publicity today was one of an Afghan who converted from Islam to Christianity. He was arrested two weeks ago and could face a possible death sentence under Islamic Sharia law. His parents turned him in.
A new report is coming out that said they may actually release him. I want to discuss this as an issue since there are many that don’t believe the United States should infringe on the sovereignty of other countries.
If they were going to put this man to death for converting to Christianity, should the United States infringe on the sovereignty of Afghanistan in order to save his life?
Comments (183)
hii!
:O….
no. it isn’t our country or laws.
Why not the entire world’s sovereignty
#4! lol
….at least Canada’s
Why should we? If it weren’t for the War, nobody would give a rat’s ass or even know that it was happening. I am sure stuff like this happens all the time and in other countries. Why is it suddenly our job to care about a country that nobody would be up and arms about if it wasn’t for the Oil War?
Erika
There are certain things worth fighting for. If we, as a world super power, were to sit back and do nothing, that could send a wrong message. I think we did the right thing, beurocrattically, by insisting that they do something, but stopping short of giving them an ultimadum.
8th!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
9…let ‘em live
YES!!!! …….. of course……….
NO
Yes, I do believe so, in that particular situation.
what did he do to us anyway?…nothing…I think Americans have forgotten George Washington’s “stay out of foreign affairs” speech
why only start to care now? It happens all the time, behind the iron curtain, and no body truly cares… I’m not saying that that is right, but why start now…
But then again, why NOT start now?…
Thankfully, the gov of Afghan isn’t too enthusiastic about it. They want some basis for which to release him. They realize that to be hardline would be to alienate the western world.
I was thinking about this today though. About what could be done. I agree with RvL1978, as usual. I think we needed to act somehow. I don’t think an ultimadum would have been fitting or necessary, since they are a government we are on friendly terms with.
We have to care about life. We have to value life. We have to defend life. Otherwise, what good are we?
yes but only on the grounds that it is a violation of human rights and international law.
It reminds me of Rwandan Genocide. Not quite the same in terms the scale but where do you draw the line for taking action?
#11!!! is that TWICE as NICE as being #1, because its TWO 1′s?
It’s important to note that he isn’t simply a recent convert in their society. He fled under the country when it was under Taliban control, was converted at some point when working with medical aid missionaries, then returned in 2002.
I think this is the hardest question you’ve asked to date. I’ll get back to you on this later.
I’m not sure. I kinda feel like someone should do something, but then again the US saving this one man could end up hurting many many more people. I can’t believe his folks turned him in knowing the law. His parents are bastards.
Ohmigod, his own PARENTS turned him in?!
nope, its their country they can do whatever they want
Yeah I think so. I would want to live if I were him.
I don’t think the US has any stake in this man’s fortune. So the answer is no.
I feel sorry for the guy and certainly hope that he is not killed. But don’t you think that he knew what he was up against by going back to his home after converting to Christianity? He must have considered the possibility that he would be martyred. Surely he knew the laws of his own homeland.
The US can’t police the world and Christians can’t force Christianity on other cultures. We can sure pray for our Muslim brothers and sisters in Afghanistan and for this young man, though.
L,r
wow thats intense. i don’t know the answer
no.
But Bush needs to take back his statement that Islam is a peaceful religion.
I was listening to a story about this on NPR a few days ago. Interestingly, there’s nothing that says being achristian is against the law, or any other religion. The readon this guy got in trouble was b/c if you’re MUSLIM you;’re then not allowed to ever convert to anything else. I thought that was interesting… and totally warped.
As to your question: I don’t think it’s any of our business, honestly. If we stepped in here, then we should be stepping in for any person in any country that is being treated unfairly. If the man was American I could see the pint in us going in and to help him, but otherwise… I don’t know.
I guess I’m stick between wanting to help people who are being subjected to idiocy in their governments and realizing that we can never right all thre wrongs, so… which ones do you focus on, and how do you go about deciding that?
no. i think we need to take care of our own issues first and then focus on other countries.
No.
627 friends…wow
you are a celebrity except you have a BRAIN and a heart! 
Not if we don’t do it for China and India and every other country where Christians (or any religion for that matter) are persecuted.
Why kill an innocent man? When laws are unjust, I think it’s right for them to be refuted. Goverments were established for the protection of the people. This man isn’t putting their job in jeopardy, or putting anyone else in an unsafe position. Why does he deserve death? I think it is everyone’s job to protect the innocent if they can.
It would be nice to think we could help every person in need weaselfeet, however, this is not realistic.
As a Christian man, I’m sure he considered the cost of his return…
Perhaps this is a better issue for the United Nations. It would seem less biased coming from a consensus of nations with various religious backgrounds than from predominantly Christian U.S.A.
It is interesting how somethings get attention over other things. People die around the world for many reasons. I joined Amnesty International a couple of years ago because I wanted to be apart of helping people around the world be able to live lives of freedom.
Like John Lennon, I’m a dreamer but I’m not the only one. Hopefully, enough people with the ability to speak out will care about and take up the cause of those can’t.
He’s not in the U.S.? Then no.
No we shouldn’t. Every country has a right to govern in thier own way. We didn’t get involved in WW 2 just because jews were being put in concentration camps.
HEY EVERYONE CHECK THIS OUT!!!! IT’S A NEW XANGA WHERE YOU DECIDE WHAT HAPPENS NEXT!!!!! http://www.xanga.com/home.aspx?user=Your_variety_show
Ryan and Daniel
No
Epicurius, are you aware of who took Hitler out?
i think that it is the responsibility of other contries to intervene any time someone is going to be put to death for their beliefs. whether that be pertaining to religion, politics or anything else.
It shouldn’t be just because of the fact he switched to “America’s religion.” Though I’m not sure what they should do.
He shouldn’t be killed because of it in the first place…
It’s against his country’s laws.
He broke the law.
If he wanted religious freedom, then move to America.
Not our problem.
Just his.
He’s a criminal.
yes
the idea might be utopian, but the world should be something greater than people killing eachother over religious beliefs regardless of what those beliefs are. I doubt the situation would be half as controversial if the man wasn’t converting to christianity.
45th
Gah you get comments fast!!
Its his right to be whatever he wants to be
They can’t tell him what he can and can’t be
Poor dude. Why can’t the world just be tolerant of eachother’s religions? That’s what I hate about humans. They always think they are right and everyone else is wrong. And the more you tell em they’re wrong to more they don’t believe you.
We seem to do that anyway so why not.
This is a difficult question… if the man was American, the answer would be a definite yes… but because he is in his own country, it’s a little more complicated. I want to say, yes we should, simply because it just isn’t right. I don’t know if it’s right to impose on the affairs of another country either though… I don’t know if there is one “right” answer to this question.
I don’t think so. I mean, I woud like to, but it’s another county, you know?
I thought Afghanistan no longer had Sharia law. I must be stupid.
I have a related side thought: Where are the big christian talking heads on this one? Where are the Dobsons, Falwells and Robertsons of the world on this one? Are they too busy sniffing out the war on christmas or stopping people from getting married to decry the imprisonment of another Christian (well, if you consider those three Christian that is)?
I think that it’s none of our business….it’s their country and their laws. If someone came over here and started to interfere with the way we do things, we’d be pretty upset. I think that we should be worrying about our own country first, and then others.
Sovereignty. While I would endeavor to assert that the nation’s sovereignty comes only into the biased hands of a few powerful men in a country who’s traditions dictate common sense, I find it hard to see that the United States has done anything wrong in strong-arming the nation to spare the man’s life. Ultimately no force on our part will be committed no matter the outcome, though perhaps a withdrawal of freely graced benefits may occur. I believe in the right for nations to openly express their concerns amongst each other. Any action will ultimately be undergone by the country in question.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=FU-qfQEGDEg
no… if any other country tried to interfere with our policies on killing people, we’d bomb them and be total assholes… you know.. like any other tuesday.
Of course, everyone has a right to choose what religion they want to practice without fear of being persecuted.
If countries can get involved in barbaric practices like female circumcision, I don’t see why they can’t get involved in saving this man’s life. Even though some will argue it is intruding on that particular culture, no one in a society should be subjected to harmful treatment like that while we sit back in our couches and shrug it off.
We are not the world police. Not the world KGB. Well….on second thought…..
This is a tough one. I would have to say yes. It’s inhumane.
RYC: My bf feel asleep through pride and prejudice. i watched it by myself.
no
the US needs to mind their own business
I think that in order for a government to have sovereignty, it has to be legitimate. a government that does not allow for religious tolerance is not legitimate in my eyes. additionally, this nation is breaking the UN declaration of human rights code. Thus, I think tat if the US or any other police power like the UN chooses to interfere, then it would be to uphold international law and not to break a country’s soveriegnty.
I saw this on the news last night and the first thing that came to mind was how sensationalized our media is. It’s true, for one man, so much publicity, over something that probably happens everyday in other nations. Every argument that the US uses as a check on abuse of minorities in the US circulates about the idea that someone will speak out for them. And although that has always seemed as an argument simply to sidestep the issue, it seems that this exemplifies how handy socity’s taste for “alarming issues” is.
just something to think about.
I am a Christian. Despite the fact that people believe we should not interfere in other countries’ business…we already do that. And to ignore this man’s suffering, though we ignore many other people’s suffering…would be cruel. No one, I don’t care what religion they are–Islam, Jewish, Christian, Buddhist, Taoist, whatever–should be put to death. Everyone should have the right to believe what they want. Unfortunately in Afghanistan, 99% of the population is Muslim. That isn’t the problem, really. Nothing is wrong with those people and what they believe in. It is the government of that country and the leaders. They refuse to let anyone believe something other than what the government wants them to. It’s sad, but this just ties in to the whole fact that Christians or people who believe in Christ and His teachings have been prosecuted for centuries. It’s wrong and should be stopped, and this man should be set free. If not, he will be in Heaven with God, but I believe he should have the right to go when his God calls him, and not when man decides he should.
i think that in this case we should infringe on their sovereignty and even though it is mostly our fault at this point in time we are the almost the only means of stability in their govt. and they should let this man live b/c all he did was converted religion and to put him to death would solve nothing so thats just my view
What are you talking about, infringing on their soverignty? We just conquered and occupied them! How can you infringe any more than that?
…I think the entire world should just screw off and let people believe what they want to believe in. Because, WHAT is the point of making someone believe something that to them means nothing?
It’s like telling me that if I don’t believe that 2+2 = 5, then I should be put to death by firing squad. Just doesn’t make sense.
They should, this is like the times of Nero, the earliest date in which persecution began for Christianity. Or maybe this is God deciding his fate, maybe God wants him to be with him now that he has found the path. But I think he needs to be saved. This kind of punishment is awful, especially when it’s a christian. It’s not just religion, persecution is all around us from every situation, big and small.
hmm….
you think you should but there are some problems.
1.there are probably alot of cases similair to this and I don’t want to sound harsh but america, with all of waht’s going on, really doesn’t have the time, and the energy.
2.if we acted we might be treading in questionable waters which we also have minimal time and energy to have atop of this war.
that’s what I think.
I think that America is messed up. Abortion and Euthanasia are already legal. So why not kill that guy too. I think if America is going to try to do the right thing, they should start right here, at home.
Because it’s a violation of human rights, should’nt it be taken before the United Nations?
Interfering with another nation’s laws, religion and culture seems hardly the right approach to me.
No, it’s not our place. We’re not the world’s policeman or parent, and we need to worry about saving the lives of people in our own country and only interfere in others when asked.
The Americans should stay out of this issue, even tho through our eyes it seems pretty stupid to kill someone who converted. Then we should prosicute Madonna!:)
while i feel sorry for him, if he really is a Christian, he will not be afraid of death. What is his country threatening him with? They are threatening to send him to heaven to see God, provided he is truly saved. He should trust God in this situation and know that God is in control, whether he lives or dies.
As to whether or not the U.S. should get involved, I would say no. Would we want another country telling us what to do?
From a human rights perspective, yes, U.S. should at least say it isn’t right ! But from a political perspective, no! The person knows the law of that country…..leave the country , then convert. Am I being naive?
I’m kinda surprised at all the answers (well one I guess) saying “we can’t impose Christianity on them”. Getting involved in this would not be “imposing Christianity” but would simply be making them more accepting of views other than theirs. It’s basic open mindedness. Now whether you believe we should have jurisdiction (spelling?) on this case is debatably.
Personally, I believe we should. If Afgahnistan and Iraq are to be the models for the Muslim world then we should teach them tolerance.
In most cases, no, but in this particular case, when a life is at stake, there shouldn’t be anything stopping US interference. Maybe US infringement isn’t right, but what about UN?
You know I just don’t know. LOL this is a hard one. Why should we have to take care of everybody? Is that possible?
Eh. Too bad we can’t ask the guy himself what he thinks. Perhaps he would be proud to me a martyr. But let’s just assume he wants to live…
If we really want Afghanistan and Iraq to have democracy, then we need to let them make their own rules. Forcing them to be just like the US is not real democracy. On the other hand, I see no reason why we can’t tell them what we think. Other countries rag on us all the time. Perhaps we could encourage President Karzai to pardon the guy and put him on a plane bound for the US or — heck – just about anyplace would be better. Karzai would be in deep trouble if he tried that, so we would have to reward him accordingly.
I would say yes, to hold onto whatever ounce of integrity our political leaders have. They say that we are fighting a war to protect those who oppose our American concept of freedom, so prove it government, if you are so mighty and omnipotent over the world, go in and save that one man… You [gov't] should be proving to us that you CAN spread this “freedom” to people. Prove it to me, PLEASE! Please give us some indication that what your doing is right! … Or maybe that’s all just wishful thinking.
I’m not sure how I feel. On one hand I think Yes. But then I think of all the Christians who are persecuted in China and other places and we aren’t stepping in to rescue them.
If we’re trying to give Afganistan more control over their government, and we want them to be powerful without us there, then we shouldn’t do anything. I think we could give the Afgan president some advice, but forcing religon on another country is wrong… i think.
I feel that America has enough promblems as it is, they should not be meddling around with Afghanistan’s or any other country’s business. I feel for him, his death, God forbid it, but if he dies, he should be a martyr.
What do you think?
PS: Funny story, today I realized I am compose of all American enemies. I’m Arabic, Russian (they were enemies formerly), and I have some Cuban relatives. What do think of that? I feel its quite morbidly hilarious, as do my teachers.
Have a good day!
Bush is caught between Iraq and a hardplace on this one. His only remaining support if from Conservative Christians. Bush claims that the people of Afghanistan are free, but this shows otherwise.
Epicurius:
actually I guess I needed to read between the lines of your statement. I see what you’re saying, the USA didn’t do anything to help the Jews escape death and torture until we oursevles were involved in the war…
Perhaps we would’ve been able to save massive LIVES had we intervened, sooner.
No. America interferes with enough of the world’s affairs. If we start telling them which of their own laws they can and can’t enforce we would really have a problem. Not to mention that Islamic extremists would take it and use it as propaganda illustrating America’s desire to “destroy Islam” or some such..
Hmm…
Well, I feel as humans we all have a moral obligation to protect people from injustice. And I believe killing someone because for their beliefs is injust.
However, I do not believe that a country has a moral obligation to meddle in the affairs of another foreign country.
So I really don’t know. Probably not.
I would make this discussion last forever. X/c it’s not like I actually know what I’m talking about.
yes
“Poor dude. Why can’t the world just be tolerant of eachother’s religions? That’s what I hate about humans. They always think they are right and everyone else is wrong. And the more you tell em they’re wrong to more they don’t believe you.”
It’s really disgusting that so many (not all by any means but some) people here have been against issues like homosexuality and seem hell bent on keeping them from gaining rights and freedoms. Yet say that this man should be rescued. Wait….he’s a Christian…odd
This is a difficult situation. It comes to a basic issue of how do you deal with a country that is essentially Muslim and bring forth democratic ideas. I have writen about it and posted many articles in dealing with this issue. You essentially have two contradictory laws the Shirah law and the constitution. On top of that you have international law that really has no soverign control, but just a general influence.
The U.S. and President Karzi have a difficult situation at hand. The U.S. is trying to effect the situation indirectly through the government. Just as the UN and member states try to do indirectly through other means. However, as to your basic question of a direct intervention of a countries soverignty regarding this issue it is difficult for me to say, but I would have to say yes and no. lol.
First, I would say yes in that an injustice is about to be done to a man. It doesn’t matter if it is done systematically through a trial or on the streets by a mob the U.S. Should do all it can to stop this.
Second, I would say no in that the Christian man is standing for his faith and willing to be a maryter for it. He knew he might face death and was and is willing to face the consequences. His faith I share and I have prayed for Him and I see the glory of God in that man. As Chrstians we are not to adhear to immoral laws that go against our conseqence as we see it through scripture and this man went against the immoral laws of his country and willing to face those consequences even unto death.
The question should be not so much what are we Christians here doing to save that man, but are we Christians here willing to be that man?
Wait a minute… I thought Christians were the intolerant ones?
No!! This is none of our business.
Ironic isn’t it?
yes, we should…some ppl will say that it doesnt matter if just one guy dies, but it does…we would not just be saving the life of one innocent man, but defeating the principle of the unfree world…by acting we would 1) show our power and abiliy to alter the mind and 2) tell the world that it is wrong to discriminate ppl because of their religion……thats what i think……
oh, and srry i cant be ur friend cuz i dont have Xanga Premium, only the free crap…but u know wat they say…it goes something like the free things in life are better…..i know thats true…sometimes…
i have more….is it not somewhere in the bible (like i would know!) that those who do not act in a situation of crisis are just as guilty as those who created the problem….well that would be a good quote to use if i knew if or where it was…maybe its in the constitution or something else….im not sure, but i know it is somewhere and thats my story and im sticking to it……
If we can rightfully invade them initially for being an ass-backwards bunch of theocratic totalitarians, we can rightfully intervene in any fashion we deem necessary if they choose to perpetuate such behavior.
Don’t know if these are too…I don’t know, unworthy of discussion, but some topics I thought would be kinda cool to discuss. Links are to news articles, to enlighten you and any other curious people to the topics I am thinking of.
Just if you run out of things to talk about.
Kansas House Rejects “Hybrid Cloning” Ban
Giant Tortise Dies at 250
its none of there bussinss is what i thaink. but…i gess since its the U.S there probly going 2 intervean and try and play the super hero and save his life. What makes it worse for the dude is that his OWN parents turned him in so what would he have to go back to?
I don’t really think it’s any of the U.S.’s business, but as humans we maybe should step in. I mean, it’s murder, he didn’t do anything wrong except by some misguided law. I dunno, maybe other people think the same thing about us.
I do not think that the US should get involved in that at all. Yes, I think it is horrible that it is happening but that is their culture. It is the same way in any Muslim country/household and even in Jewish homes (granted they may not kill you…but you will be cut off the family). There are people killed by their own family because of that. If we get involved in one situation…we would have to get involved in all of them. Then what about all the other things? In India, bride burning is common – where the bride is killed by her husband to get dowry and it will be considered a “cooking accident”. There are so many things that go on that we would never be able to help. It is ingrained in their culture…us intervening will not stop them from trying to kill him.
We have to speak up for those without a voice, of course when it comes to Christian martyrs no one in the US will speak up remember Rwanda and the Congo, or perhaps you haven’t heard that story.
That is just horrible. Why do they have such stupid laws like that? I mean it’s just stupid. I think we(as the people not polititions) should pray for him and those polititions should get their hineys over there and help out(legally of course). No koups. Have a sunshine day Dan.
that’s a tough one. there’s a lot of different issues involved and such… infringing on their sovereignty would bring about more problems, probably, than letting them put the man to death. it’s horrible to think about, and i hate comparing one life to a heck of a lot of problems, but the real answer, in my opinion, would be no, it’s not ok for the U.S. to do that. i wish him the best of luck, though, and congratulate him on his faith but not so much on his survival technique.
Since this is a country we recently liberated, I believe we do have an obligation to exert some influence in this case. And it doesn’t make any difference if he’d converted to hinduism or some other religion. I believe I heard this morning that Condoleeza Rice had said in rather strong terms that we didn’t approve of this sentence, but woud not interfere with their legal system.
Yes, because we wanted to get rid of those extreme laws in Afghanistan after all!!
That would make it look like the U.S. is a Christian country, or somehow promotes Christianity over other religions.
depends how you define infringing on sovereignty — if you mean doing some diplomatic arm-twisting to save him, yes. if you mean a military rescue mission, no.
If my life was at stake and ANYONE has the power to save it- I hope they would use it.
(((((( GRANDMA HUGS ))))))
Lori
well, america was founded on the principle of freedom of religion so we are inclined to say yes, infringe. if we do infringe on afganistan the only argument we can put forth is freedom of religion. if we do, we would also be making a statement. now, any country who doesn’t have freedom of religion might have the US on their back and this could cause a foreign backlash. so on this one, i dunno. personally, i want all countries to have the same freedoms we do in the US, but that means conflict with some foreign governments.
NO! We have no business starting that again…
For those of you shocked that his parents turned him in…a quick note about Islam. Converting to Christianity is like the worst thing a Muslim could do, and they do it knowing they will likely be disowned by their families, if not turned over to authorities and killed. In Afghanistan, they are ruled by Muslim law, and it is illegal for an Afghani to become Christian. Just like it’s illegal for us to commit murder.
To answer the question then, I would truly love to say yes we should intervene, but from a Christian standpoint I can’t. It would probably turn into the crusades all over again. However unfair it may be, the best thing we can do is pray for the guy, and pray for the country. Pray that this man’s testimony and possible martyrdom brings more to the Christian faith and is a witness before the world.
We have a different value system than we do. You would all be offended if the Afghani’s came in here and tried to interfere with the legal system using Muslim values. Why should interfering in a Muslim country using Christian values be any more acceptable. The ignorance of this is painful.
I think the USA is doing the right thing by getting this guy out of “arms way”! Why? Becuase they’re persecuting someone for there religion & if they are going to be a ‘democracy’ like us then it’s not right… Even if we wasn’t a demoncracy it still wouldn’t be right to do; & I’m glad we are as Americans… We have FREEDOM; at least mostly so… Ya know, freedom to vote for who we want to, freedom of speach, freedom of press, freedom of religion, ect. ect.
~Ash7-Ashley
don’t get me wrong, i would love to see Christians stop being persecuted, but it is an honor for a Christian to die for Jesus. so i think it’s a win-win situation, actually.
i don’t know
… ok… yes. nobody should be executed for what they believe. can’t they just export him or something? =P i can’t believe his parents turned him in.
I don’t think Christianity has a leg to stand on when it comes to condemning other religions as violent.
the US should do its best to save him
think about it…this may sound heartless….
but you have to look at the big picture. unjust things happen everyday, in the US, everywhere. If they infringe on Afghanistan’s soverinity they throw all their values, all that the war they fought in that country stood for (if anything) out of the window. The point was to install democracy. That is what they did. The point was not to install a democracy that they can meddle with a control, but an independant democracy which rules its own country. Just because the Afghans are making a ‘mistake in judgement’ that could cost someone’s life does not mean the US has to interfere. How many times would other countries have like to influence the US in decisions that cost many people lives? But they couldn’t, simply because if the USA decides to destroy someone, being the world power they are, that country is dead.
I think the USA should start trying to fix things internally instead of nitpicking at other countries, because ‘the land of the free’ is far from liberal and doesn’t treat everyone equally.
I don’t agree with what’s intended for him but can the US really go in there and do anything.
no, I think the un should, because he would be a prisoner of conscience. the US doesn’t need any more crap, honestly.
stefan
The US should definitely help this man. Taking a person’s life just because he changes his belief…totally wrong! And for the U.S. to just sit back & watch…we’re just as bad then. For instance, if you were to watch someone else murder another being, you are just as much a murderer. I understand that we shouldn’t intrude into other nations thinking we’re the World Police, but as humans, we can’t just sit back & watch.
As much as it pains me to say…no, I do not think the United States has the right to infringe upon any other democratic nations sovereignty. Until Afghanistan wants religious freedom as much as the US did, in 1776, we’ll continue to hear to stories like this.
oh wow, NO!
I don’t know exactly how far we should go politically speaking. As a Christian my heart breaks for this man and what he’s going through. It would be wrong to stand by and do/say nothing. I would like us to do as much as possible…but in the end it’s in God’s hands.
As fun as it would be to kill thousands of people for not following our cultural acceptance of religion, that is not the way Jesus told people to spread Christianity. This man knew what he was doing when he converted, and considers the reward greater than his own life. This is a great display of the ideological difference between Jesus and Muhammad, Christianity and Islam. Christianity according to Jesus’ (non- historical catholic) perspective is to be spread through love and truth, not with sword, spear, or rifle. This sort of thing will happen repeatedly in Afghanistan, we can not intervene for every martyr. These hateful Muslims will never tolerate anything besides Islam, they need a new religion, not a new government. No military can force an ideological change on such a hateful group of people.
Hahahaha
This crap happens every day. The US would we stupid if they were to try and intervene on this one isolated incident.
I mean for real. Christian converts to Islam are tortured and killed every day by Middle Eastern government. I don’t think that the government should, or that it will.
hello how r u
I… do not think we should interfere. Please understand that I am a Christian, a very conservative one at that. I believe we were right to take action in Afghanistan and in Iraq, though my personal and un-enlightened oppinion is that our forces should be coming back now, with only small forces still there to support their country if needed.
This situation in Afghanistan is not entirely unique, but it does tug my heart-strings. I believe two things are at stake here: 1) Our involvement in that sovereignty persists solely to prevent and to flush out terrorist bands involved in possible or certain attacks on the US of A, not the regulation of their legislation, however morally wrong we deem it, and 2) this Christian man entered into Christianity knowing that his choice would merit pain and danger, and New Testament Christianity consists of the testimonies of martyrs starting with Christ and continuing on. By interfering, we not only overstep our bounds as a country, but I believe we are also interfering with this man’s “trial” and the witness he has as a newborn Christian trying the genuineness of his faith. I know that sounds cold, and everything in me wants to call for a raising of arms on his behalf. Knowing the biblical principles of authority and jurisdiction, however, our prayers are due, but our hand is not.
No. Regretably this stuff happens all the time. There were riots against Christians recently in Indonesia. Chinese Bishops are still in jail. There is no way that the US can or shoudl be the world police. The only way to change people heart is via prayer. Not to say we should not apply a bit of diplomatic pressure.
ppl like to pick & choose who they’re gonna be heroes to/for. & $$$ always has a way of making ppl very heroic.
“do unto others as you’d have them do unto you.” if some1 was gonna slit YOUR throat for your faith/sex/race/nationality/etc, wouldn’t you want some1 to help you instead of turn their back saying “it’s not MY problem.”?
“One death is a tragedy; a million a statistic” -Stalin
Tell me when this isn’t happening? People think this is the first time that law has been tested before? You think no one has been executed for leaving the muslim faith?
This is nothing new, and the fact that the american people are even occupying their thoughts on the matter NOW shows to me that someone decided to run with the story for a reason.
The american public is completely fickle and stupid. Instead of demanding answers and investigations of our own countries actions, we prefer to allow ourselves to be distracted by silly little humanist pieces about one person.
So yeah, let’s get involved in it!!! We went into that region for no reason, we have no proof of wmd…most of what we’ve been told is bullshit, so why the hell stop now? Let’s get involved in this so we don’t have to think about the real issues….yeah, that’s the ticket.
I’m not sure. I get so mixed up in stuff like this.
Hi Dan,
It’s the Colemiester. I have thought about this long and hard. when I first got word of it from the AFAs email that they send me about this situation. my first and impulse reaction was to email Preisdent Bush like the AFA suggested and ask him to help spare this mans life. then I got to thinking about this morning.
Afganistan is in a pickle if it frees the man that will 1) be can afront to Islam 2) also be a major blow to islam for releasing an apostate and 3) cause rebellion among common and clerical Muslims and we could start the crusades all over again.
As a Christian, the guy’s in a win-win situation. so i say just let the afgan justice system runs its course
Most industrialized nations do not have the death penalty. We are also the only country to put people under 21 to death, as well as people who are mentally retarded (IQ under 60). Should other countries rush in everytime we put someone to death? I am sure many people in those countries pray for our condemmed to be saved, but rarely spark international incidents over it.
Nope. Our country has its own laws as their country has their own laws.
hi. leave me some comments and sign my guestbook please
this happens often in china, cuba, some african nation….why aren’t w trigger happy about civil rights there? is it because of trade? is it because they’re too volitile to pick on? i don’t know. since we’re there in afghanistan anyway, there should be some way to get him out and give him asylum here, and i’d vote for that. on a more genral scale, though, i feel like the US definitely picks and chooses when it wants to get its dander up.
well, the comander general seems to have no problem with invading soverign nations for other reasons, does he?
ever heard of a martyr…?
Since the time of Christ there have been over 69 million Christians maytered for their Faith. I think its aaout time we do something about this as a country founded on the princpas of Christanity. Too long has the rest f the world turned a blind eye to Christian myrters. But we xcant waltz in ther and kill to save one life. At least he is going to heaven and be done with the wretched life of a citizen of Afghanistan’s islmic laws. those of you who do not know what a true hero is, That is a real hreo.
God Bless,
Wade
Converting into Christianity in a foreign land that’s against it, that’s nothing. How about millions of innocent people being killed everyday for crimes that they didn’t commit sounds for a change?
That would be injust. I’m tired of the U.S. trying to be some kind of sheriff. It’s not our buisness it’s theirs. So the answer is no. U.S, STOP!
But off the subject this might be contadicting but personally I think that is wrong.
that sucks… they don’t have freedom of religion there… but i think eventually they will.
I think that we cannot infringe upon thier sovereinty the man knew the laws of his own homeland and knew the risk. It’s a shame he has to be a “martyr” so to speak but the most we can to do hope this man isn’t killed, America can’t intervene in everything we have our hands full as of now.
-DDA
random propz
No, we can only hope that the Afghan court system makes the right decision. I’ve always thought it was a bit pompous of the United States to try and butt in on what’s going on in other countries just because we can.
eww your gay
I make fades. Check out my site.
I make fades. Check out my site.
To all who want to know more about life:
My site has been and will be posting the Facts of Life every day from now on, until I either run out of Facts of Life or I die. They are random and some are funny, some contradict others, and some are not true-according to the real world. So feel free to visit my site and comment on what you read!
No way this is the UN’s responsibliity and there should be a seperation between Church and state so Our church should have no say in this and this is of an Afghan law and this person has clearly violated.
Religion is an opiate!
Why not? Why?
There are two sides to the mirror, one that only goes one way, and one that reflects back upon us..
Which one is more important?
[ariana]
the only one 2010, you are so right. Others, you think that since we didn’t help Chinese Christians we shouldn’t help this Arab out? Like, you picked you nose when you were a little kid, so you’ll just have to keep on picking it! Stupid once, condemned to be a idiot always.
If we don’t help, we make liars of ourselves. We are not there to help as we said we would. We need to save this guy, and any more after him. Man, I’d hate to be in trouble anywhere and have to ask you liberals for help. You don’t believe in helping anyone, I see. So, go stay in your own little bubble, and peddle your sorry ideas to other weak-minded and lazy people. Oh, I just insulted you. Sorry about that. It seems to happen whenever I hear people saying, basically, “Well what can I do? I’m just one person.” interpretation, I’m not interested in anyone. I’m mean, and I’ll let you go to hell and will not lift a finger.I have got to stay away from bittersunday’s site. She’s rubbing off on me, and I’m enjoying it!
Without a doubt
The UN has a piss poor record of trying to get their way with countries’ sovereignties.
no
No, nothing should have been done. The government of the United States has forced the government of Afghanistan into a democracy. Now we are trying to force them into Christianity as well? This is not a governmental law that is saying that they are trying to put this man to death by, it is ISLAMIC law. For the record, I AM a Christian, but I am not ignorant enough to believe that MY religion should be everyone’s religion. Their are too many cultural differences to have one single society that has all the same morals and values. Just be thankful that you are living in a country that DOES support your difference of opinion.
As I read a few people’s comments, I’d like to make one more statement. I hear a lot of, if we sit back and do NOTHING, we are just as bad as they are. Well, guess what, everyone IS as bad as we perceive that act. Every single day people sin, discriminate, hate and turn away from what is happening around them. Before pronouncing that the US should go in and stop this governement from doing what it’s laws say it should do, stop for the guy who’s car is broken down on the side of the road. Volunteer some time at an old folks home. Volunteer coach a high school sport. The problem with society is that we are a bunch of people that sit back and profess that everything is wrong and that everyone ELSE should do something. Things get done and changed and the world becomes a better place because you are a doer… so why don’t YOU go do something today.
Yes, but why aren’t any other countries doing anything?
my name is sarah
I am but three,
My eyes are swollen
I cannot see,
I must be stupid
I must be bad,
What else could have made
My daddy so mad?
I wish I were better
I wish I weren’t ugly,
Then maybe my mommy
Would still want to hug me.
I can’t speak at all
I can’t do a wrong
Or else I’m locked up
All the day long
When I awake I’m all alone
The house is dark
My folks aren’t home.
When my mommy does come
I’ll try and be nice,
So maybe I’ll get just
One whipping tonight
Don’t make a sound!
I just heard a car
My daddy is back
From Charlie’s Bar.
I hear him curse
My name he calls
I press myself
Against the wall.
I try and hide
From his evil eyes
I’m so afraid now
I’m starting to cry.
He finds me weeping
He shouts ugly words,
He says its my fault
That he suffers at work.
He slaps me and hits me
And yells at me more,
I finally get free
And I run for the door.
He’s already locked it
And I start to bawl,
He takes me and throws me
Against the hard wall.
I fall to the floor
With my bones nearly broken,
And my daddy continues
With more bad words spoken.
“I’m sorry!”, I scream
But its now much too late
His face has been twisted
Into unimaginable hate.
The hurt and the pain
Again and again
Oh please God, have mercy!
Oh please let it end!
And he finally stops
And heads for the door,
While I lay there motionless
Sprawled on the floor.
My name is Sarah
And I am but three,
Tonight my daddy
Murdered me.
There was once alittle girl named Chelsey Mcaun. She was killed in1933, by a homicidal maniac who buried her alive while chanting a satanic chant.Those were the words spoken, and now you have read them…Anyone who reads the chant will meet this small child. In the middle of the night, she will be on your ceiling, as you sleep, she will suffacate you as she was suffacated.. Unless you send this to at least 20 people before tommorow, so she will leave you be. Some guy read those words,
yet he didn’t believe it. So he didn’t send it. The very next day, his parents found him lying DEAD on his bed. chain lettters. i hate them
* Don’t send back*
Howdy sir,
Things are good as I hope they are for you.
God bless
Come check out my icons;; they’re love.
MUCH <333333333333333333333.
Come check out my icons;; they’re love.
MUCH <333333333333333333333.
oh you are so handsome and sexy.
It’s a tough question. In the west we have this idea that there are ‘univeral’ rights, such as a life to rights, or freedom of religion. These things are of course not universal. They don’t come from some sort of universal thing which everyone knows. They are firmly rooted in our judeo-christian background. We may thing it is bad that someone is put to death for ceasing to be a muslim (note: he isn’t in trouble for being a Christian, he’s in trouble for converting away from Islam).
Now, in an Islamic society, all these ideas about tolerance, freedom etc… are simply not there. For conservative (not necessarily fundamentalist) muslims, tolerance means following sharia law. I saw an interview with a top cleric in Iran who talked about how Iran was great in term of human rights because they treat everyone fairly according to sharia law. That may be well and good, but I’m sure many women (and Christians, and people of other faiths, Maneans, whatever) do not exactly feel tolerated.
So the question is, do we have the right to enforce our view of tolerance on and Islamic society? I think that the oppresion inherent in sharia law is sickening, but that doesn’t mean I have a right to change it,, according to my judeo-christian values, at least not directly. Remember tolerance? So what can I do? I can’t tell them that it is universally and obviously wrong to kill this man, because it isn’t. I do think it is in fact wrong though. My right to interfere can only come from another judeo-christian value, defending the innocent.
This is the only approach I can see which makes any sense. If I were to base my interference on the fact that what they are doing is obviously wrong, they can simply say it isn’t. But I am a Christian, and so I am not acting based on their principles, I am acting based on mine.
To me, it is not important if according to their society he should die. According to my beliefs, I should help him, remember, he is an actual person, who could actually die, not just some face in the news. Being unconcerned about his death is being complicit in murder.
no
i think that regardless of what we do, we have no power in that nation. it’s true that the truman doctrine (i think that’s the one) says we are obligated to protect the basic human rights of all civilizations, but you don’t see the government flying in food to Ethiopia every week where the droughts have caused mass starvation, so we could protect their right to life. No, we send our food to Afghanistan. There’s not a dire need for it there. We just want to get on their good side so that the select few of them who might decide to grow up and become terrorists rethink their hatred towards our country and it’s pushy, domineering, yet good-natured and helpful interests. The Romans used to feed Christians and Jews to the lions. The Christians waged Holy War during the Crusades. The Muslims have their jihad today, and the Islams have theirs, too. Persecution due to religious belief is nothing new in the world, and it cannot be ended. If we step in, we are bluntly stating that their beliefs and practices are wrong, and thus, persecuting them. And who are we to judge them? Our culture has burned its own at the stake for their religious divergences. Hate crimes are an everyday occurrance. There are religious groups who stand outside funeral homes when military officers die, stating that they deserved death. We are just as screwed up and confused as them…
“According to my beliefs, I should help him, remember, he is an actual person, who could actually die, not just some face in the news. Being unconcerned about his death is being complicit in murder.
Posted 3/26/2006 at 4:21 PM by Jamescrocker”
That is exactly right!
Yet, a majority of the people who have an opinion on this don’t think of this man as a person. They see him as a symbol. A symbol of Democracy. A symbol of Christianity. A symbol of Freedom. Now he gets set free on a technicallity. Everyone is disappointed. Why? Because THEY never admitted they were against Democracy or Christianity or Freedom. They said their wasn’t enough evidence. If this man gets beaten and killed in the streets tomorrow, few will bat an eye. Why? Because all he is to anyone is a symbol, not a human being.
Yes, if they United States could
i think so…otherwise what kind of country are we?
No, it is not our place to intervene with the workings of another country. Its is our right to religious freedom, not theirs. This may sound conceited, but it is true. They do not have the freedom of religion, but such is their choice, if they want to have this freedom, then they will do something to get it, in time. We have done too much liberating a system with no support other then an offensive front. Now we cannot arbitrate a case that has nothing to do with us. We are not the worlds constable anymore then we were in the early 20th century. And this is the young mans battle. He chose what he thought was right and now he must deal with the consequences of his actions. As must we all. In brief, no.
And isnt it the Monroe Doctrine that says we are obligated to protect the human rights of all civilizations?
The US should offer him sanctuary. Or just conquer Afghanistan and make it a state. That’s not an option though since they have no OIL.
I don’t think we should go in and do anything. Growing up in the Islamic world, he is probably well aware of the consequences for his actions. So I’m sure he didn’t do this brainlessly. Of couse, that is to say that, as we know, this guy couldn’t be brainless. So…? He should’ve know this would have happened!
Here’s my opinion. I was discussing this with a friend and came up with this analogy. Afghanistan is like a house a house that America built and then sold to the Afghanis. But America is still paying the bills, we have a large amount of troops over there and without us the country would fall apart. So while America should not intervene in force we need to let the country know that we do not support this and that religious tolerance is KEY to democracy. If the gov’t decides to execute him i say that we pull aid from the country. If we countinue to help them after they execute someone for their beliefs then we are no more tolerant than the Muslim extremists.
Now i read today that the court wont even hear the case and that raises another fun ethical dilema. Once released the man’s life WILL be in danger. Several Islamic clergy have called for his murder if he is not executed. So what should America do onece he is released. Do we leave the poor guy to his fate and do nothing or do we do something that might make the Muslim world hate us even more? Just a thought
thnx dan!
yes, we should… why? because we’ve been given the power to change that which is wrong to that which is right… i am for the war in iraq, as long as what we are doing there will change the world for them into something more bearable…
why arent we in darfur, halting the “generational cleansing” that is taking place? why arent we in uganda, discontinuing the lra’s abduction of children into an army? we can, and we have a duty to humanity to do so… but we sit on our asses saying “its not our fight”…
we only got into WWII when japan attacked pearl harbor… lazt americans!!! get up and move!!!
I know a man in Egypt who was a Muslim and also converted to Christianity. His family found out and paid the Egyptian government money to get him imprisoned so they planted drugs in his house and arrested him. The US gives money to countries who prove they are doing something to stop drug usage so Egypt’s police commonly do this. This man has now been in jail for 14 years, most of it in solitary, no visitors allowed until the last four years. It will cost 200,000 for the judge to even hear his case and finally, after 14 years, members of his church have earned that money by selling his paintings. If he is able to be get out of prison, he has to runaway because once his family finds out, they will try to have him killed. I think that this happens a lot, and as sad and terrible as it is, if the U.S. helped this man, shouldn’t we help everyone like him? Which is impossible. I think it is terrible what people do over something like religion, they are full of hatred, but unfortunately I don’t think that the U.S. has a right to do anything about it.
personally, i don’t think the states should interfere because if we step in for one person we should be willing to step in for everyone that has a problem. a few other people made notable points that we shouldn’t present ourselves as a christian country as well as the fact that we should be more involved with helping our own. we spend all this money and media blitz on one even that won’t really help later down the line when we could all be giving that much attention and dedication to issues such as poverty, education, health care, and the youth.
who is america?
lordy! lordy!
everybody dance.
no. BUT, it should be made international law that any country that puts a man, woman, or child to death for religious reasons should get sanctions against them. In no way shape or form should somebody be killed for changing religion. its just not right.
NO we cannot, not even to save this man’s life. if there were a pattern of genocide, if entire villages that were Christian were being destroyed, that would be a different thing.
remember, though, that this man was raised a Muslim, in a country where Shari’a is well known, well publicized, and in non-Islamic circles well criticized, so he knew what the consequences of his conversion might be. it is the power of the love story between God and humanity, as expressed in the sacrifice of God’s son, Jesus, that brought this man to the place where his life as a Muslim was worth less to him than being a Christian. it is his choice to give up his life, if it comes to that, to stand witness to the God we serve and to God’s Christ.
As a Christian myself, I don’t personally believe it is an issue that requires our government intervention. Most Christians (especially those in the middle east) consider these risks and chose this lifestyle on their own volition. Honestly, I wouldn’t expect any gov’t. intervention, foriegn or otherwise, if I were in those shoes.
We should allow him to come USA, so he could look me up, in my hometown. I would show him what true Christianity is all about. It is to live life to the fullest, be successful, love others and himself, be good and honest to the max, help out the poor and homeless, make a stand for what he believes in, and make a name in politiks for the NEW JERUSALEM and THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN, here in the nw. I understand he is in Italy, at this point. Wonder what happened to him after I transferred him in the Name of Jesus Christ, in the twinkling of an eye, here to the US…? Maybe Bush saw to it he was expedited to Italy, because we have a THING about illegal aliens, right now,and it is not “good face” for Bush to OK an illegal alien to this country, even if it was God’s Will that his life would be spared through that kind of “salvation.” When I e-mailed Abdur Rahman, in the first place, I had intended that our church should back me to accept neighbors of our particular community into our church, minus their turbans with hidden bombs. That was an incident, I recall, that was handled when someone close to me took a pitcher of drinking water and poured it through the crack in the opening of the suitcase, that diffused a bomb inside, when a trickle of smoke came through it. Nice timing. It did not go over, that I had previously invited TROUBLE into our peaceful congregation, at that time. Now, I have second thoughts about going to that church, since they FORGOT to worship Palm Sunday with any mention of JESUS or the ascension into Jerusalem that happened nearly 2000 years ago! I am here. I will wear a hat on Easter…but where…? Surfing city.