June 1, 2008
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Lying about Virginity
A court in France gave a Muslim man an annulment when he found out on his wedding night that his wife was not a virgin.
The wedding party was still going on when the man walked out and said that the bride was not a virgin. The woman did not bleed during intercourse and so he had no blood-stained sheet.
The court gave the man the annulment on the grounds “that his bride had deceived him on ‘one of the essential elements’ of marriage.” The bride also admitted that he had “led her groom to believe that she was a virgin when she had already had sexual intercourse.” Here is the link: Link
Do you think deceiving your fiance about your virginity or the amount of times you had sex before marriage is deception on an essential element of marriage?
Comments (107)
Sex before marriage is how I was made!
I love how your photo has more comments than the blog entry it was intended for
Depends on your beliefs and/or religion.
I would prefer honesty on that count, myself. I plan on being honest, I expect the same back.
But seriously, lying about sexual activity to someone you’re spending the rest of your life with is just wrong.
Yeah, that’s a pretty important thing to lie about.
However, in many Muslim countries they’ll kill a woman (but not a man) who has had sex before, even if she was raped. So it’s hard to make a judgment on her for lying.
But if my husband lied to me about that, I’d be very upset.
In this day and age, I don’t think anyone cares. But, lying about anything that intimate is going to lead to problems later on. Yeah, it’s kinda shitty to lie about something like that.
Yes… I think she married the wrong guy if he ditched her because of it…but then she probably knew that going in and that’s why she lied.
@adifferentkindofbeautiful - Hmm, perhaps. If a woman is raped in traditional Saudi culture, she becomes ‘damaged goods’, and is therefore generally unsuitable for marriage.
Yes.
Deceiving sounds like a bad thing, but not having to tell all or explain yourself before you became exclusive with your spouse to be – not such a bad thing?
@Amandasbiggestfan - Me too!
@Amandasbiggestfan - Sadly this is also applicable to many other religions…
I doubt she would have lied if she didn’t think she would have been judged by it.
Well yes. A lie is a lie, and starting off a marriage with a lie like that isn’t good at all. Lieing PERIOD in marriage is an element of not only marriage, but in everyday life that should be avoided. Deception only causes trouble in all areas of life weither you are religious or not
if you’re muslim, then yes. though i do agree with “nutshell_88″ above me–considering what kind of pressure these muslim women are up against, it’s understandable that they sometimes lie in the hopes of evading dire consequences.
but if you’re atheist? no. seriously, in the free world (or western culture, whichever your mind more readily associates liberalism and loose women with) who hasn’t had sex before marriage? the likelihood of finding a bride anymore who has not lost her virginity is so slim that if virginity were counted as a criteria for marriage, no one would be having weddings anymore.
then again, that WOULD mean less divorces probably. perhaps this “virgins only” rule should be more enforced. lol
Muslim culture is not applicable to most of us on Xanga. (Most) Muslim women are confined to such crazy standards; she probably felt that she had no choice but to lie.
I’m honest, but I also know that past decisions don’t always reflect who a person is today, so not everything someone does needs to be told. A lot of my friends were pretty slutty when they were younger, but now they’re more responsible. Lying to your SO is wong, but like I said, I doubt SHE felt like she could be honest.
Honesty is an essential element of marriage.
What it comes down to is this: HONESTY is an essential element of marriage.
whoa
Deception in the first place is not a basis for a solid marriage. She should have been honest and saved herself the embarrassment.
I would be mad but not to the extent of divorce.
no
For me, no, I don’t appreciate to be lied to but it wouldn’t make or break my desire to get married to someone if I found out they had more partners than they had previously indicated.
As mentioned though, if you lied here at worst your partner may call off your wedding, if you lie in other parts of the world and are found out, you may wind up dead or ostrasized from your family. It’s not right but in certain circumstances I understand what would compel someone to be dishonest.
I don’t think it’s a good way to start a relationship, but there’s really no good time to come out and say you lied. I can definitely sympathize with the woman, but I think she probably should have talked to her husband before they were married.
starting off a marriage with a lie isn’t good
Not everyone bleeds their first time- It bothers me that the fact that she didn’t bleed was viewed as a confirmation of her lack of virginity-
Yes.
Marriage is based on trust and commitment. Both of things are violated by a pre-wedding lie.
I’d be a bit on the edge to find out my husband lied to me about his virginity. Virginity is very important to me. It’s one of those things that should be given to your spouse, not to your boyfriend.
I do think it’s a bit over the top of how they anulled the marriage; but of course I think Islam is a bit wacked out anyway.
I guess I would want to know how many lovers my wife to be had so that I can know exactly to what high standard I would need to perform.
Because I need to be the best, one fucker to rule them all.
Ha! Well she lied and if that was on the top of his list of things that were VERY important in order to be his wife than hell why not.
I think that it is deception on the elemant of marriage, because one of the main values of a relationshia and of marriage is trust. With out trust there is simply nothing.
If ya gotta lie, you’re with the wrong guy.
This could be a non-issue anyway because not all women bleed when they lose their virginity.
I think you should tell your fiance’ if you are not a virgin because to not tell them would be deceitful. If the man/woman really loves you then it is not going to matter if you are a virgin or not.
If it is understood ahead of time that one or the other was a virgin then yes that is a VERY bad foot to get off on. BUT not every girl bleeds – sometimes girls lose their hymen earlier in life from trauma that is not sexually related – and I do not mean rape. This woman admitted to lying and she did deceive her groom – that is way bad.
no, but then again, it leads you to wonder if someone lies about that, what else are they lying about?
I would hope people would be honest about that either way with their respective partner. I have to wonder if the Muslim guy was also a virgin. Seems to be a bit of a double standard there. Also it is my understanding that a hymen can be broken before intercourse for some women so it doesn’t mean that all virgin women bleed. Where is the grace in all this fuss? Weird.
Well, I’d be kind of upset if she’d lied about it, but I wouldn’t divorce her because of it. It’s a stupid thing to lie about because she’s probably afraid I’d judge her for it. But honestly…I don’t care, as long as she’s disease free and isn’t fucking around behind my back.
This is, of course, assuming that I could even get married, which isn’t possible.
@Kristenmomof3 - agreed
In a way I think it is deception but it’s not vital and to be honest if it wasn’t for sex before marriage I wouldn’t be here.
is the past partners if any, anyone else’s business? i think not unless some sort of potential health problems with either partner arise hint: std
not everyone bleeds, right? that’s crap…
I think that given her culture, she had no choice but to lie. That being said, not bleeding during first intercourse isn’t necessarily a sign that you’re not a virgin.
I suppose. If they’re that religious.
There are many of those same men who are really in love with their S.O. before they wed. A lot of these men cut their fingers and bleed on the sheet and hang it outside so that their new spouse’s honor stays in tact. Stupid? I don’t know, it’s just a different culture. I think they could teach us a thing or two about keeping crime down. As far as my opinion on the matter goes, I’d just like to quote Ricardo Arjona, “Si el pasado te enseño a besarme asi…bendito sea el que estuvo antes de mi.”
I think that if that was an important issue to him he should have brought it up before they were married.
If he had done so, and she lied, as she confirmed was the case, he should have known his bride better…but to judge the fact that she was not a virgin on the fact that there was no blood on the sheets is a crock.
Did he even KNOW the person he was marrying? Honestly. What the heck. This is dumb.
Yes, if you lie about that, you could be lying about anything in the future. How can you trust your partner if he/she is dishonest?
As for the bloody sheet thing…not everyone bleeds the first time. Some people have their hymens broken through an accident, sports injury, etc.
I don’t know.
But if my guy (whether it be my fiance or just my boyfriend) lied to me & said he was a virgin when he wasn’t I’d be really pissed off.
Deceiving your fiance about anything makes for a poor start to a marriage.
RYC: Not everyone would.
And no, your assumption is not correct.
Thank the LORD in Heaven above, they won’t have any terrorist babies now! Woooowhoooo
@A___Beautiful___Disaster - Good answer
@Amandasbiggestfan - i agree
I don’t think people should deceive their spouse about such things.
I don’t think that it’s THE essential part of a marriage, but it certainly is essential. How could you lie to your husband about whether or not you’ve had sex? In their culture, however, that is the essential part and so I understand why it is a huge deal and the man was allowed an annulment. It’s a extreme deviation of cultural and religious norms.
I don’t think a lot of people still really care about staying a virgin until marriage.
But I guess if you’re Muslim, that’s a huge deal breaker.
no, it just makes you an asshole.
@adifferentkindofbeautiful - Dude, sometimes it amazes me how much people eat from the media. I’m a Muslim woman living in America, and I do not feel limited at all just because of my religion. In fact, most of the Muslims I know, are just like you or me. Really, I can’t think of anyone who was, “forced” to wear the scarf, or to cover themselves, except the people in other countries. Please, I’d advise you not to blame my religion, but culture. I know you put “most” Muslim women, but even that is not the case. Most Muslim women that live in 1st world countries, who have been exposed to Westernization, can make their own choices. So before you begin to generalize why Muslim women are limited or unliberated, think of our beautiful sisters as individuals… Not a whole. You shouldn’t always believe what’s on the news.
Gosh! The question never came up. Maybe it’s because I didn’t want to look like a MORON!!
I probably wouldn’t divorce them for not telling me…but it would be a litte hard to be sure if thats the only thing they didn’t tell me.
Then again, it doesn’t matter. I agree with Amandasbiggestfan, sex before marriage was my creation as well, so…
*shrug*
@elvish_fairy - I’m speaking from personal experience. Sorry, I should have added “in the Middle East.” In France it’s similar to here, but I still noticed how women were expected to behave.
I don’t even watch the news.
Thats some straight BULLSHIT ! M glad we dont do shit like that in America ! ! !
Deception is deception, and honesty & communication are foundations to a relationship. I would like to point out that not all virgins bleed their first time. Often the bleeding is from the hymen being broken, which can be done with physical activities, especially those like gymnastics and horse back riding. It can also be broken by fingering/masturbation, and other tampons. Doesn’t necessarily have to be a penis that breaks the hymen.
I wouldn’t lie about something like that, but then again I am not a Muslim. I agree with those that said she probably felt like she couldn’t tell the truth.
All guys I know are interested in sex, so I’m sure a guy would have broached the topic with his girl way before the topic of marriage even came up. If you lie then, you’re going to have to carry that lie on for the rest of your relationship. =/
Yes, absolutely. I certainly am NOT always in favor of abstinence until marriage, but I do think that a marriage relationship particularly should be free from lying.
And not all virgins bleed. I didn’t.
It depends on if that is something the culture as a whole values. If impotence or infertility is grounds for annulment (it is in Texas and many other states), then why not virginity or lack thereof? It speaks to what marriage means in a given society.
Well, lying is not a good way to start a marriage. And I would want to at least know they had been checked for the major diseases if they had sex before.
I don’t think that it is something to be lied about. I don’t lie. I wouldn’t want to be lied to about it. I mean it is something that is pretty important. Is it something to break up a marriage over? I don’t think so, but then again it probably can change depending on your beliefs and how you were brought up. I think it is terrible that the reason for accusing her of not being a virgin in the first place was the fact that she didn’t bleed but that is just me. It would depend on how you were brought up if you felt the same way or not.
i hadda come see if anyone thought it wasn’t a deception on an essential element of marriage…
@havechanged - TRUE to that.
in this modern times, such information to tell your husband before marriage is stoopid really. that’s from strict muslim countries, where such things still matters, sadly.
get real, 80% of the world’s population have sex before marriage.
I most certainly did not bleed when I lost my virginity.
Oh okay, I see how the discussion was sparked from your other posts haha.
Yes, I do think it’s decietful, but of course just because you don’t bleed doesn’t mean you’re not a virgin. But yes, lying about yourself to your future spouse (especially when it comes to your past sexual activity) is not okay.
Pass me the ketchup please.
Yes.
1. Just because she didn’t bleed does not mean she’s not a virgin.
2. I think lying at all is wrong. If my future husband was to tell me he was a virgin, and then after our wedding tell me he actually wasn’t and he had lied, I would be very hurt. Not at the fact that he wasn’t a virgin (although I would be a little sad about that), but the fact that he lied to me about it, and that he didn’t feel like he could trust me with that information. It’s not to much the essential of being a virgin or not, and how many people you’ve slept with, but whether or not you’re open wiht your husband or wife before you get married, not just after.
i guess it is if your fiance really really cares about that kind of thing.
i would not want to marry someone like that and a good way to prevent that is to tell the truth and gauge the reaction.
That’s just stupid. Do they know women can get hymen repair surgery?
Honesty should be a an essential element of marriage. As for virginity alone, I think this depends on the culture.
@nutshell_08 - Indeed I don’t get that – The man isn’t at fault to have pre-marital sex but a woman can be killed for it…. Err…. So the man was having pre-marital with another man then I guess, I mean, they couldn’t possibly have overlooked the misguided irony of that one?
Oh and I still don’t get why I’m the only one still whining: WTF! Who the hell takes the blood stained sheets from their first sexual encounter, with their new wife, to their wedding guests??
How seriously wrong is that in the first place? Forget the whole is she, isn’t she a virgin issue! What’s next, a damn webcam vidcast of the actual event? Or perhaps a Hymen cam?
Why not just cut the poor head and mount it on the damn wall with the rest of the archaic trophies and save the poor the indignity of a lifetime with this arsehole (but he deserved it being typed).
Well, she shouldn’t have lied about being a virgin, just because of possible diseases and such. However, I can understand why she did, living in a culture where it’s socially acceptable to go announce to the entire extended family “o noez, she wasn’t a virgin.” I mean, good grief. I don’t think it’s necessary (or wise) to give a play-by-play of your past sex life to your spouse, though. Broad generalizations are best imho.
Wow I at least waited until we got to the hotel
I didn’t figure the guests wanted to share in all aspects of our happy day 
There’s a pretty large disparity between Muslim culture and my own, so I can only speak from my personal experience. Though I’d want to know how many people my partner has been with before me. I wouldn’t care for any of the gritty details, but just a number. Maybe a second number of how many of those were one night stnad sort of situations. I think it’s important to know for health reasons, and important to be honest for trust reasons.
Lying is generally bad, but like what many had suggested above, it is understandable that women who are confined greatly by religious expectations will lie about their virginity. It is also unavoidable that most men are selfish bastards who saw themselves being not a virgin prior to marriage not much of an issue but a problem when the parrallel happens on a female. I will keep my fingers crossed, count the years as they go by, till complete gender equality is achieved.
Maybe i won’t live that long.
Perhaps he may have wanted to watch this first? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jzm-kt1LBjo
yes
Dear Dan:
In both the Christian and Moslem faiths, we hold adultery to be wrong. We also hold in common the prohibition against bearing false witness. However, where the two faiths diverge in practice is on the points of love and forgiveness. Among Moslems, such things concerning women can be the cause of savage reprisals. Under such a culture, it’s easy to see why the bride would have lied about a past indiscretion.
As a prospective husband, I would expect my bride to be honest about past affairs as I would be to her. Past “entanglements” have a way of cropping up when one least expcets it! As a married couple, people vow to “forsake all others”. That does not mean, though, that those “others” may follow suit. It’s just one of the reasons why a married couple should be honest with each other in all things. After all, their vows are supposed to be for life.
But without the factor of loving forgiveness, none of this is truely possible. That’s why so many Moslem marriages are loveless, repressive arrangements. Christian marriages also fail for this reason… along with a selfish contempt for the very vows they give before God.
I’ve learned in my Sexual Behavior course (no, it’s not what you think), that some virgins don’t bleed after having sex for the first time. So, in a sense, if the woman really was a virgin, then this guy practically made a deadly wrong assumption and was given an annulment over false circumstances. But if she wasn’t, then some honesty would have been appreciated in this situation.
yes, deception and lying are bad. BUT I have to agree with the people who take into account that they were Muslims. The Muslim community has a much higher, stricter code of morals and ethics than people in the Western world are used to. If a woman is raped or has consensual sex before marriage, it is grounds for what’s called honor killings in some places.
I’m not saying the bride should have lied, but I don’t blame her either, she was covering her own ass and hoping to live long enough to be married.
I think honesty is one of the most important things in a marriage. The groom found out on his wedding night that his bride had being lying to him. I think it is fair ground for an annulment.
I agreed honesty is important but, that guy is a jerk.
I think it’s wrong to lie to your partner about your sexual history, just as it’s horrible for a man to decide to throw away a relationship with his bride just b/c she’s not a virgin. Unfortunately in certain societies (ahem, see article above) it becomes necessary for women to lie like this as otherwise they’ll be ostracized, and who knows if the sex they had before was even consensual.
i feel like if you can’t be honest about that… what says you’d be honest about anything else in your past?
sounds like a great basis for a lasting relationship..
Bleeding is NOT proof of virginity. That’s so outdated and medically not accurate. Many things can happen.
She may have been very honest with her husband.
That being said, yes, couples should be honest with each other, as much as the other wants to know (some do not want to know previous details) Honesty is the basis for a good marriage. But getting hung up on previous boyfriends/girlfriends/spouses/sex lives is NOT a good basis for any relationship. You are committed to and with this new person; keep that relationship a sacred covenant, and that will be the basis for a strong marriage.
…in the essential list of things that build a mature relationship ..i don’t really know where to put virginity!! ..it simply does not fit in!!!
but seriously, it all depends on the your belief system
I for one wouldn’t marry someone who isn’t a virgin, but that isn’t the point. The “essential element” is honesty. If you’re going to marry someone, you should be truthful about everything, and the fact that she was lying to him before they were even married isn’t good.
Yes, but only because you should never lie to the person you plan on spending the rest of your life with. If a man would break off a marriage just because the woman wasn’t a virgin then he never really loved her anyway.
Depends on the relationship.
You should always be honest!
I don’t think you should lie to the person you’re going to marry. So…yeah, it is a deception.
just because she didn’t bleed, doesn’t mean she’s not a virgin anymore. but if it were true, then yes. and besides, as i am tired of using religion as a defense, traditionally, muslim men pay a large amount of money as dowry for the women they marry. and those women are supposed to be virgins. if you paid for something broken, would you keep it?
owh i got it from one of the comments, they kill those woman for having sex even she’s being raped??! that’s crazy! how unfair they treat them..
well im from a muslin country and,, kinda shame cause i dont knw that..
anyways this is one of the nice posts that i’ve seen today^^ cheer~
not really, but the problem is she lied. she led him to believe she was, and whether its right or wrong to want to marry a virgin thats not the question in hand-besides thats his preference! and he married her believing she was a virgin. So she lied. Not only that but with majority of Muslim men virginity is important…if she was going to lie she should have just had the operation and covered her story better!!! Its quite silly nowadays though to expect to marry a virgin, more Muslim girls are becoming sexually active…
im not saying he was justified, its just the principle of having been deceived.
the way i see it, you cant lie about it and get away with it! the guys going find out sooner than later, and then what? stuff like this publicized, why not admit the truth before taking things too far and getting married to the wrong man. If she was honest with the guy she would have been judged but not internationally so as she is now.
hmmm i missed part of the question, so to those that dont mind if their fiancee isnt a virgin, its not a so bad a deception. but to people like the guy in the situation then its defo a biggie…
I think it’s something married couples should know about each other before the marriage, yes. It’s an honesty thing. That way, the couple can work out any ensuing conflicts before the marriage takes place.
Sad story, though. I wish the couple could have talked things through. Then again, I have no idea of the dyamics of their relationship, and I have no right to pry.
@Amandasbiggestfan - Well then I’m definetly never going to have sex before marriage YIKES!