August 30, 2008
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Cheating on the Sick
This is part of a letter sent to Billy Graham:
“My wife is totally disabled because of a massive
stroke and probably won’t ever get better. Now some of my friends are
telling me I’m crazy not to find a mistress.” Here is the link: Link
Do you think it is only natural to cheat if a spouse is disabled with no chance of recovery?
Comments (111)
I know if I ever had a disabled spouse, I would never even think of cheating on him. The guilt from the pain I’d probably cause them would be too much to live with.
hmm
Honestly? Yes.
That doesn’t mean it’s the right thing to do, but you will feel naturally compelled to do so. If you say you won’t, you’ve either never been in the situation, or are lying.
Personally, I’ve never promised anyone forever, but I think I would have to discuss it with him and say, “Look, you’re no longer fulfilling my needs.” I wouldn’t sneek around or anything.
Not natural for me, anyway. I can’t speak for the rest of humanity.
I understand WHY it happens but I dont think its fair. Is it too cruel too divorce and not cruel to cheat and lie to your best friend?
*kaff*
In sickness and in health! So much for that. -_-
It is not natural.
Guilt all around. Too messy for me.
You have to be in their shoes to understand. You really cant say unless you have been in a certain person’s shoes. .. Dont say that its wrong if you arent in their shoes…Pleeeease..
I would find someone to satisfy my needs, yes. But I would discuss it with my S/O. Sneaking behind their back would get me nowhere, and they would need to know I needed to fulfill that part of my life. If they refused me the option of finding someone to be there for me for that, I would probably break up with them. Someone who expects me to live the rest of my life with no satisfaction shouldn’t expect me to stay with them. Sex is too important a part of a relationship for me to live without it.
Hard to choose between divorce and cheating. Though I do think in sickness and in health should mean something when you get married. And alot of people dont remember that a relationship shouldnt be all about sex. I mean if the lady isnt going to be getting any better then ya gotta think, that her getting anymore worse, she’ll just end up dieing. So take the time you have with your loved ones. If she passes on…..then in couple of months or maybe a year then the guy could think about dating again. But anyways thats just me……………
The guilt would definitely kill me, I don’t know that I’d be able to do it.
Shuryken!
@theladyofabundance - *applause*
Shit, I don’t even know. Couldn’t tell you unless I was in that situation myself. I would hope not though… I like suggestivetongue’s idea of discussing it with them first. I’m sure they would understand that you have physical needs too. /shrug.
Is it natural? Yes. A whole lot of what is evil in the world is the result of human beings doing what comes naturally. Is it right? No.
In the lack of good nookie, of course the mind (as well as the lower panty line) will begin thinking of alternatives to the sick and more flaccid than a wet stick of margarine husband, but I don’t think I would. To death do us part means something to me. Besides, if the urge ever got that bad, they do make battery-powered friends to get you over the hump (pun intended).
Sex is NOT the most important part of life! Just because one partner can’t have sex doesn’t mean love ends, man how shallow is that.
No, never.
This scenario reminds me of the very first Poison Ivy movie that came out back in ’92. (with drew barrymore and that emo chick from Roseanne.) She was I think a high school student and was living with her friend’s father, who’s wife was dying. And he cheated on his wife who ends up dying.
The girl ends up dying in the end. I dunno, nothing good comes out of it.
Because sex is the be-all and end-all of life – it’s akin to air.
divorce and no cheating or seek sex elsewhere and be a life long care taker to someone you love who is no longer able to be your lover? love and lover are two different things.
@theladyofabundance - Exactly.
I couldn’t do it. I do not believe in cheating under ANY circumstances. I think it would take a person who only cares about themself and their needs to cheat in that case. Its case of “my needs are so great that I am going to hurt you to fulfill them.” I am sorry, but they sell toys to take care of sexual needs. Granted, they won’t be able to take care of ALL the needs, however, you can find a new form of intimacy with your spouse. The whole idea of this makes me feel sick to my stomach.
man this reminds me of the most infamous case in history where Claus von Bulow’s wife Sunny was basically in a vegetative state and he cheated on her with former Dark Shadows star Alexandre Moltke (Isles). There was a whole crazy case about it due to insulin.
Her husband, Claus von Bülow, was convicted of twice attempting her
murder, but the conviction was overturned on appeal, as dramatized in
the book and movie
Reversal of Fortune
. Many aspects of her persistent vegetative state remain unexplained and a subject of conjecture and controversy.
I would say yes. I mean man.
No,I do not think that I would do that….
@bluemarsupial - exactly.
Why not just tell his wife that he’s gonna go take care of his needs?
there is a wonderful movie with ken howard in it called A Vow to Cherish that covers this topic. it is well worth seeing.
sadly, yes…. :/
I actually believe in that “for better or for worse,” and “in sickness and in health” stuff.
Whatever happened to the idea of LOVE? If you love someone, you stay with them. If their (sick partner) is unselfish and want YOU to be happy – then you can decide whether you want to stay for better or worse, or do your thing.
@la_faerie_joyeuse - What about loyalty? My husband is going into the army and I won’t see him for months. Since he won’t be fulfilling my needs, should I go find a squeeze who will? I would never think of cheating on him.
The vow says in sickness and in health, until death do us part. Adultery is still adultery.
I would say no, its a matter of for better or for worse………I would bet that a lot of spouses who have commented NO has really never thought about it before…but it kills me that a lot of marraiges are based on the sex part only………………
@UnworthyofHisgrace - Amen.
I think, both should agree it would ok, not sure I could handle the guilt.
well why cant you have sex with her paralyzed body?
When I care about someone, I don’t find others attractive in that way, because my mind would just turn to the person instead. I’d be sad about the situation, but other aspects of my feelings would keep me from messing around with another guy.
I think if someone is the type to cheat, it would happen whether or not the partner is disabled. To me, this sort of falls under the category of “not being satisfied,” which can occur in much less severe situations (where there’s less guilt).
Ooh Ooh! What if it was leprosy!
It’s natural, no doubt…whether or not it’s right is another matter.
It is natural to get those feelings and urges but its morally incorrect. If you make an agreement for the spouse whatever, but it’ll probably get messy.
um no… that would be the ‘for worse’ in the “for better or worse”. Ya know?
No, there is no way I would cheat on someone I love, disabled or not. Love is about so much more than sex, but having sex with someone else would inflict much pain on my spouse and damage our relationship.
Um… are you people serious?! Sex is NOT a need. I’m 21 and have never had sex because I’m waiting until marriage (AND I’m a man). So far I haven’t died from a lack of it.
Also, when you are married you make vows for the purpose of assuring your spouse that you will be faithful to them in SICKNESS and in health. This kind of situation is the one that vow is referring to. DUH.
IF THERE IS EVER A TIME YOUR SPOUSE NEEDS YOU TO BE FAITHFUL TO THEM, IT IS WHEN THEY CANNOT DO THINGS ON THEIR OWN.
C’mon people, grow up and realize that the world is not all about trying to satisfying your silly little libidos. Learn to love.
oh, and the picture is hilarious.
I would hope the disabled spouses would allow it. I know I would.
Well, he could still technically have sex with her.
It’s heartless, but yes, I do think that will come naturally. You want someone who can give you attention, physically, mentally, emotionally, and sexually, and if your partner can’t do that, whatever the case may be, sadly, you will start to look elsewhere for it.
“Natural”? That’s not the word that comes to mind.
“Ultimate betrayal” fits better.
What happened to “in sickness and in health”?
I vowed “In sickness and in health”, so I would never even consider it. To cheat on a disabled spouse is still cheating, and it is still 100% wrong.
no way. it’s called respect yo.
@JessicaAshley7 - There’s a difference between someone being gone for months on end and someone who will permanently be unable to provide even the most basic companionship (my boyfriend is in the reserves, and has been away for several months for basic and AIT, but I certainly had no inclination to cheat on him). But if your husband had been gone for months, where you could
only talk to him occasionally, and even then he was distracted or unable to really communicate, and you
knew you were never going to cuddle with him again (or maybe even have a normal conversation again!), things might be
different.
I’m not sure about the extent of the stroke by this guy’s wife,
but stroke can wipe out entire sections of thinking, language, or
memory in the brain, in addition to the physical impairments. If you take the physical closeness away, if you take the communication away, if you take away the mental bond that you share, then what’s left but memories? Well, I think you’re religious, so there’s some spiritual bond through God or something, but I don’t believe in that. And even regardless of that spiritual bond, you will feel naturally inclined to cheating if you’re missing the other aspects – just as it’s natural to sin according to your philosophy.
And just because you’re naturally inclined to do something, doesn’t mean that you are going to or should do it. It’s all a matter of what you think would ultimately make you the happiest. And if you’re still deeply in love with this person and would so desperately hate to see him hurt by your infidelity, then certainly, it would make no sense to cheat.
People cheat as a natural thing. . if they choose to, but I personally think people should not cheat on their spouse. So what if they are disabled, he/she married his/her wife/husband and should not turn their back just because of a disability. .
x0x MK
Ha, well, the man walking through the door in that picture is definitely not disabled, but the guy in his bed probably will be in a minute.
@Strong_Protector - As a virgin, I’m afraid you won’t know how much the act of sex draws two people closer together and expresses the love they already feel for one another when they are in a long-term, committed, monogamous relationship. Suddenly not being able to have that any more would be devastating not just for your health and happiness (since these aspects of sex can be replicated through masturbation) but also for your mental connection with your spouse.
And sex isn’t everything that’s lost from a relationship when one partner has a stroke. Depending on the extent of the stroke, cuddling, normal activities, or even communication can become impossible.
Be faithful or just leave.
What ever happened to sacredness & love?
No
To say that it is necessary to cheat is cheapening what a true relationship and bond are. I fully believe that if you have a truly healthy and strong relationship then sex is just an added bonus and not in any way a necessity.
Uhhhh….
I have to admit I’d be absolutely tempted to find a mistress. I’d probably be lonely as hell and physically and emotionally starved.
That said, I wouldn’t. I’m assuming I truly love this person (we’re married, right?) so the fact that they’re braindead wouldn’t really matter. I still wouldn’t feel right doing it until she was dead. Sounds awful but it’s true. Not that I’d want her to die, obviously, but I couldn’t be with anyone else until she did.
Being disabled doesn’t mean you can’t have any fun.
There are books about how to get it on with different types of disabled people, actually.
Besides, I believe in the whole “in sickness and in health” jazz, and if you really love someone you should never have an urge so strong it forces you to cheat. That’s just awful.
It’s natural… actually, it shouldn’t be done, but… -_-
I can understand, but it’s no way, shape or form an acceptable excuse. It’s like saying, “Well if you didn’t go off and get disabled I wouldn’t have strayed.” I mean it seems to me the cheater would be punishing their significant other for something they couldn’t control/forsee. I say, either work through it or end the relationship. It doesn’t mean you can’t still help care for the person of course.
I couldn’t do it to my guy though, yea sex is important but knowing the pain it would cause if I did find a ‘lover’…I couldn’t live with myself. Love for me is more than the physical…though it is important I’m sure there are ways people can work it out.
I don’t think I could do that to somebody I love. Temptation might be natural, but acting on it is different. I know that love for another person is a lot stronger than my love for sex.
Whatever happened to, “in sickness and in health?” It would be totally selfish for that to happen. I don’t see how it can be natural for someone to want to satisfy their needs with some stranger when they’re married to the love of their life.
@JJ_Ames - sex itself, or getting off?
natural yes
right no
whoever tells you to follow you nature is either lying or deceived
No, spouse should stay true to their marriage. Cheating is cheating! If the other half died then that’s another story.
I think it depends on the character of the individual. Some people are strong enough to follow through with the vow they made… “in sickness and in health.” We live in a world in which morals aren’t all that important anymore. That’s why a lot of people will think that wanting to cheat is natural. People don’t take their vows seriously. So, yeah maybe it is natural in this day and time, but it still isn’t right.
I think…it’s natural, an instinct that most (?) would fulfill. But could I, as a person, do such an act to my partner? No.
yeah i think it is… but i’ll never do it, it’s to upsetting and unfaithful. i know how it feels to be cheated on and it’s very painful! i hope that guy knows what he is doing. *sigh*
as for that picture, lol… those nice sharp toys on the wall will be put to use. lol. j/k.
no. i am in this postion and the answer is no no no.
i think i would tell him to …if he so desired…
No, cheating is still cheating. You make vows to get married for a reason and you should follow them.
I don’t think it matters whether it is ’only natural’. Everyone has desires, and everyone wants those desires to be met. But the end doesn’t justify the means.
Unless she’s in a vegetative state, she might well have the same desires he does. He certainly isn’t the only person in the world suffering from unmet desires.
(And If your friends think you’re crazy, it might be time to get new friends or professional counseling.)
Don’t care about the article or link. I wanna see the sequel to that pic.
Heh, as long as she’s fine with it, it’s not cheating.
I’d do the same thing, honestly.
But I’d make sure she was fine with it first.
… Well, maybe.
natural to feel the temptation and act on it, but not neccessarily moral or right.
Nope.
If I didn’t love the person, yeah I’d cheat…but if I did love the person, no I wouldn’t cheat
I thought you married someone because of love, not so they’d fulfill your sexual needs. Sheesh. Just go touch yourself if you have needs so much. Your partner is already sick, he/she doesn’t need to be more hurt because of you.
No. The vows are for “better or for worse…in sickness and in health…”
@SpiritualBattlefield - So you’re saying that only the person who does the terrible deed can discern whether it’s wrong or not? That it’s actually not wrong if there’s a strong emotional justification in that person’s mind?
Well, golly-gee, then. We’ve been locking all these thieves and murderers away for hundreds of years for nothing!
Tongue-in-cheek aside, though, I think a more effective way of evaluate the right-or-wrongness of a situation is to put yourself in the shoes of the person being victimized by it all, rather than the person doing the victimizing. Wouldn’t that make a wee bit more sense?
No way!! That is just cruel!! Especially if your spouse found out!!
This is tricky because you can’t really know unless you’re in this sitch. I would imagine that you’d think about it. It sounds pretty awful but maybe if the spouse gives the green light it would be okay.
what about his wife’s “needs”?
Natural? Yeah, everyone wants sex
The right thing to do?
not even close
that person needs your support not your penis
It’s insulting to the “disabled” person. One of the reasons that broke up my marriage was that my ex started cheating when I was misdiagnosed with cancer when I was 23.
yes
No. “In sickness and in health. For better or for worse.” Remember that? “Til death do us part.” Not, “until you are disabled and unable to fulfill my needs.”
@SpiritualBattlefield - I’m assuming, then, that you would be completely okay with it if you were on your deathbed and your spouse, rather than taking the time to pay attention to you and be with you through your misery, was around screwing other women?
I’m not arguing. I’m simply correcting your fatally flawed view on morality. Terribly sorry if you’re not good at taking criticism, but the fact that you so viciously lashed back at me after my little comment just goes to show that you haven’t really given the issue any thought whatsoever.
“for better or for worse…in sickness and in health”
@fullmetalbunny - Well said! I think some people must believe that having their fingers crossed for that actually exempts them. I think “better or worse” or “till death do us part” apply here too.
@SpiritualBattlefield - Well, now I’m a bit confused. Earlier weren’t you saying you thought it wasn’t wrong to go and sleep around behind the dying spouse’s back? That’s the impression I got, anyway. If you meant to say that it is, in fact, wrong to sleep around behind the back of a dying spouse, then I suppose this argument would all be based on a silly miscommunication. So which is it? Is the cheater doing the mortally ill person wrong, or isn’t he/she?
No. If you love your spouse enough like you are supposed to, it’s wrong to cheat. Cheating is anything you wouldn’t do in front of your significant other. Sex isn’t the most important thing in the world. Everyone should be able to exert self control.
no
@la_faerie_joyeuse - I would appreciate it if you valued my opinion. I disagree, and because I’m a virgin you say my opinion is somehow not as valid as people who have had sex. I find this ridiculous. I am assuming you aren’t a virgin. If you were, then you wouldn’t try to make the point you just made because then your opinion would be just at “worthless” as mine.
But what I find the funniest is someone who has thrown away her virginity is telling me, a person who is waiting because I see the value and beauty in the gift of sex, how important sex is to a relationship. I know how important it is. That is why I think you should be faithful to the spouse you have given your vows to. Do you know what a vow is? Do you know the reasons we give them?
I do know how much sex draws two people together, that is why I am waiting, and it’s going to be beautiful.
You are trying to come across as strong and knowledgeable and wise. When really you have a weak opinion based on making yourself happy, not your spouse. When I am married, I am going to honor my wife regardless of her state because I am going to choose to love her no matter what. I am going to marry a woman with the same values and it will be amazing (not perfect) and beautiful.
@ArphaxadHunter - Like I said, it depends. ..
It depends on which shoe you are wearing.
I cant say .. but if it were me.. I would do what made me happy.
Now, in my Dads case.. .
I hated being in the middle of it because that was my daddy. You see?.. THAT is where I say it depends. I am angry in defense for my Dad.
But me personally..If I don’t love someone.. I will not even be with them dying or not… I dont waste my time nor theirs.
.. Crap, I keep getting off the subject dont I?..
Haha..
Okay
NO, I do not think that he or she is morally wrong. Morals are self gratifying anyways.But it seems that we are always immoral by someone elses opinion.
Whether someone is dying or not should not matter. I mean, either you are devoted stay..If you have lost the love, go..dont waste precious lifetime
@SpiritualBattlefield - I definitely agree that if the person doesn’t love his/her spouse anymore, it’s only fair to both parties for that person to leave, regardless of the circumstances. The problem with that is that in a lot of cases, leaving leaves the sick spouse helpless. I mean, who’s going to look after a recently divorced dying person?
Of course, that could be a good argument for why a person should still stay with their spouse even though they’ve already mentally moved on in life and love. I still say, though, that it’s a bit shallow to stop loving a person just because it’s become inconvenient. Ideally love ought to live on even with a terminal illness.
I don’t agree with you on the point that morals are self-gratifying. On the contrary, I think morals have a lot more to do with reputation than ego. If knowing about something someone did would cause people to lose respect for that person, then what that person did was wrong. It’s all about pleasing everyone else in society. No one can survive for long as a complete and total outcast.
@SpiritualBattlefield - Concerning your second comment, which I think you might have deleted so I’m not going to divulge its contents to the general public, that actually reminds me a lot of the novel Like Water for Chocolate. I think that the only fair course of action for everyone would be to divorce the person you don’t love, sick or not.
Natural? maybe. Right? no. What part of “In sickness and in health” in marriage vows should be misconstrued to even think it is alright to cheat on a spouse who can no longer fend for themselves as they used to. Our vows are “till death do us part” not “till one of us gets sick” The whole concept is on I can not conscribe to.
I really don’t think I would ever feel like that would be ok for me or for my spouse to do. That’s just not cool at all. Or at least it is not the kind of relationship that I would ever hope for. I cannot imagine feeling good about cheating ever, regardless of the situation.
I agree with “randomneuralfirings”. It’s natural to be selfish, to try meet your needs before your spouse’s, to sin! (Just like it’s natural to lie when you’ve been caught doing something wrong).But it’s supernatural to love someone unconditionally, for their sake because you are committed to the vows you’ve made to them before God, and to put your own needs on the back burner! I think that it is something that I would only be able to do with God’s grace.
My husband is a lot like Billy Graham – he loves me so unconditionally! I have a condition where I am sick two weeks out of every month, and it is a condition that is likely to get better, not worse over time. But he has not only never come near to cheating on me, he takes care of me and helps with the housework and has decided to postpone post-graduate work for a long while … I love and trust him like no one else I’ve ever known, and his commitment is so sexy! He could be selfish and try to get his needs met elsewhere when I can;t always meet them, but he wouldn’t have my love and trust, nor be the amazing, godly man that he is if he chose that path.
No, it’s not “only natural”.
The honorable (albeit unpleasant) thing to do would be to get a divorce. Because, ultimately, an affair will only end up hurting the disabled party even more.
@ArphaxadHunter - Exactly. I agree with you 100 percent on that and I stand my ground.
haha .. Now, we rule because we agree.
Absolutely not…
@SpiritualBattlefield - Hooray for agreement!
@randomneuralfirings - I was going to same the thing!
Not if you truly love your spouse.
I know it sounds like a cliche, but if you’re experienceing the real thing, you’ll scoff at yourself for even considering it.
I used to think that it would be natural to cheat if your spouse was disabled, but then I actually saw an example of true love. It wouldn’t provide for cheating no matter what.
No. When you with someone it’s for better or worse even when you are dating. If the relationship is not working out no matter what then you get a divorce or you split up- you don’t cheat. If it was happing to you, you wouldn’t like it if they cheat on you- so why do it to others?
I can understand why the temptation might be stronger for some people, but I certainly wouldn’t cheat on a disabled spouse. They’re still your spouse, in sickness and in health, ’til death do you part. Whatever happened to honoring one’s marriage vows?
nope.
No. I could never cheat on my spouse, disabled or not. When you say those marriage vows, it’s for better & for worse, No matter what. If you can’t handle that, you shouldn’t get married. Besides, how could you ever live with that guilt?
It may be understandable, not it’s still not right. Marriage is a lifetime commitment “in sickness and in health.” It should be honored.
I realize that I’m taking this out of context, but I have to admit, that when I read the question at the end of this post it brought up an interesting point. “Do you think it’s only natural to cheat if a spouse is disabled with no chance of recovery?”
I have a permanent disability, and have since birth. There is no cure. Does this mean that it would be natural for my boyfriend (who happens to be able bodied, if that’ll make a difference)to cheat on me too?
I wouldn’t think so, because I was already disabled when we started the relationship, therefore, he knew what he was “getting into” so to speak.
Just an interesting thought.