February 20, 2009
-
Admitting to Murder
Remember the 8-year old boy who killed his father and his father’s roommate after his father spanked him too much?
He pleaded guilty to a single count of negligent homicide. He admitted he “did something risky and dangerous that ended the life of the roommate.” He does not have to serve any time in a juvenile detention center. He will have to have to undergo “mental health examinations when he’s 12, 15 and 17.”
The thing that was interesting is they did not want the boy to admit to killing his father. They said it was not in the child’s best interest to admit to killing his father: “If the kid is ever going to have a chance at a normal life, how is he going to deal with `I pleaded guilty to killing my dad.” Here is the link: Link
Do you think the boy should have been forced to admit he killed his father?
Comments (89)
it’s a tough one considering his age. Just b/c he didn’t admit it to the court doesn’t mean he hasn’t admitted it though. I’m sure there will be a lot of therapy needed in his case.
I think it’s worse for him mentally to not admit to what he’s done. Force probably isn’t the best way, either, though.
How can a kid who killed his father ever really have a normal life?
Kid’s going to have a hard time having a normal life no matter what…
No. The court decision seems reasonable.
I was going to say, “I don’t think he’d ever have a chance at a normal life if he didn’t admit what he did.” . . .But I’m thinking “normal” is pretty much out of the equation at this point.
No. It’s a terrible story but he’s a kid and all he needs is help, not a trial.
No, because he may not even know what he’s talking about, and he may be innocent, and just said “I kill zem, jes”, because he was effing SCARED.
But if it’s inevitible he’s guilty, then life goes on.
Of course. He did it. That’s how it is.
HOWEVER. I have been in close contact with someone who was in a similar situation. She was beaten constantly by her parents, and sexually and verbally abused, and when she tried (repeatedly) to get help from either the police or our high school’s counselors, they pretty much did nothing. Except send her on her way home again when they caught her living at a friend’s house instead of in her own household.
Somehow, she got hold of a gun. And she shot her mom, killing her.
While I think that all murder is wrong, I understand why she did this. No one would come to her help, so she took matters into her own hands. At her trial, she openly pleaded guilty to killing her mother - how could she deny shooting her, after all? And while she was sentenced to some time in prison, despite being a minor, there were certainly people who thought she was completely innocent of her actions – and that it was rather the police and the school counselors that were guilty for this murder, because they had done nothing to help.
So perhaps the boy was in a similar scenario.
actually, that WAS the thing to say. admitting to murder = bad, especially when it’s true.
legally speaking, of course. i see a Law & Order: SVU episode on the horizon.
Either way it wouldn’t amend the problem here. There are too many issues surrounding this case, and hopefully the boy will get the hlep he needs. Once a crime is committed, especially murder, very little would make the public completely happy. The decisons made should reflect the role of the justice system–and that would be denunciation, deterrence, rehabilitation, and public safety. This case is very unusual because it involves such a young child. Charges are often dropped when people plead guilty–very normal–that is just the way of plea negotiations. The prosecutors get a guaranteed conviction, and defence is given a deal. After that the Court has to take in consideration the kid’s future–because he will still have to be a supposedly productive member of society one day.
No, that’ll ruin his future.
How is going to deal with the actual knowledge that he killed his dad?
And admitting to something to yourself/friends/family/ and the world, and pleading Guilty to something in court or being convicted of something in a legal sense can be two different things–as hard as it is for some to comprehend. If this went to trial the prosecutors would have to prove, beyond a reasonable doubt many things. The legal world is very complex.
To see this situation from a legal viewpoint and moral viewpoint would produce two different answers.
There’s no way he can rationalize something like that at that age.
He’s going to have to say that he did it one day. Why not now?
I live in Arizona and the sad thing is this gives them the right to bring this back up when he is 18 and they will knowing Arizona. It does not let him off the hook. He will have to admit to it later when he is older. He will have to live with what he has done the rest of his life. Whether forcibly or not… His mental health needs to be taken in to consideration, but what is it that will truly help him? But he will always be known as the boy that shot those two men. Sad really.
Nobody should ever be forced to confess anything. That’s why confessions obtained by means of threats, coercion or torture have little value.
he shudnt be forced in any case hezzan 8yr old & cleerly not capable of pleeding for hymself nor of understanding wat he did thatz wat the mental helth xamz will be about wen hez older
@JustMe003 - Agreed, he should have admitted it. And probably be institutionalized.
The kid is probably a sociopath, and he should either be thrown in prison or put to death.
Um no one should be forced to admit they commited a crime, let alone a child. Theres a reason we have the 5th admendment in our consitution.
That kid already has problems, so it’s going to be hard for him to have a normal lifestyle. He did it, he should admit it so hopefully the guilt will stop him from doing it again to someone else…or who knows, he might use it as a reason to kill hahaha.
since i’m not an 8 year old, and i haven’t been for a long time, i don’t know what would be in that child’s best interest.
i do think, however, that inside that kid knows what he did.
it’ll just take a little maturation for the gravity of his actions to set in, at which point he will eventually have to admit — at least to himself, if he hopes to start a recovery process from the guilt — that he did, indeed, kill his father.
right now, though, i don’t know what good would come out of forcing an 8 year old to admit to that. either way, he’s going to have to deal with what he did for the rest of his life, whether he admits it right this instant, or some time down the line … while the rest of us are probably going to forget this incident in a matter of months. heck, some probably won’t even remember this an hour after posting on it.
uhhhhh yea!!!!!!! i mean, is he going to go through life thinking it was OKAY or acceptable to kill his dad?! either way, when he’s old enough, he’s still going to know what he did… but at the same time, i think he’s already got mental issues. murder at the age of 8??
Whether he said it or not he will still remember it.
The kid is fucked up.
I wonder how many spankings it takes to get to the center of one’s neurotransmitters making them want to kill you o_________o;
The fact is he did kill his dad. And whether he admits it in court or not, that’s something that’s going to affect his mental and emotional health. Honestly, the sooner he comes to terms with his actions and himself, probably the better.
I can’t even begin to understand this story.
If he did it, he should admit to it.
I think some people are missing the fact that this 8 year old kid, took 2 lives! I don’t care how old you are, you need some hardcore help to take anyone’s life, in that way.
I’m not sure how could you force him to do that. Sure, you could threaten him, but some people would rather take the consequences of not talking. Legally, he doesn’t have to incriminate himself.
Psychologically, I don’t think it’s wise to bury guilt. But if I were his lawyer, I’d try to limit the charges as much as possible through plea bargaining. If the prosecutor was satisfied with him pleading guilty to only the one case, I’d tell my client to act accordingly.
I think the father and the roommate were lovers.. I think the boy knew it and after being spanked on top of everything else he snapped and killed them.. Wether he admits it or not he will never forget what he saw the day he shot them both to death.. thats a sentence no one can take away.
wow, I never heard about this news before..
I don’t know…its a tough call.
@JustMe003 - My thoughts exactly…..
they told my brother to plead not guilty to shit he did too. He was like 14…..and stole a 4wheeler and some other bad stuff, but his attorney or whatever told him to plead not guilty…my mom was like um wtf aren’t you supposed to be teaching him to be truthful and honest?
37th!
(WARNING: The following comment is grossly sarcastic.)
No. We should also give him a “particpation trophy” (just like little league) so he’ll feel better about himself.
Children today are too delicate and need to be handled with “kid gloves.” We shouldn’t make them admit to being bad; we shouldn’t use red pencils to grade their papers either. That might bruise their psyche.
do they not think it is important to find out what made him committed such a horrible act?? what is the world coming to? a 8 yrs old boy killing people…
@onlyFORaLILwhile - exactly my sentiment
He did it. Simple as that.
I bet his favorite movie is the Godfather !
I was sure I heard he admitted to it on the news….when he was questioned without a representative. I’m sure he was counseled not to say anything under oath.
Doesn’t not admitting to something so traumatic go against everything psychology stands for?
If he admits or doesn’t admit he killed his father, either way he knows what he did. He needs to acknowledge what he did. Though I’m pretty sure in a court setting where he is being forced to speak is not the best place for him to come to terms with it. One day he will have to say it. And I agree, he will never have a normal life after this.
Everyone knows he did killed his father. He can’t denial it forever, at some point he have to face the truth of what he had done.
talk about the death of right and wrong.
“negligent homicide”………… that’s when you accidentally run over your grandma while backing up your car.
taking a gun and planning to murder your dad and his roommate is deliberate.
i don’t care if the kid is 8! that just means he’s precocious.
He’s just the Doogie Houser of murderers. a “prodigy” if you will.
what the hell !
One would think that the bigger risk to the boy’s normal life would be the act of killing his father, not the act of admitting it to a court.
Why force it? This is just sad all around.
Soapbox Alert:
Let this be a lesson to people who think hitting a kid is the most effective form of discipline. It’s, um, NOT. Definitely not in this case. I’m sad that there are two dead men, but it’s completely unrealistic to think you can whale on your kid when they’re small and vulnerable and not expect any consequences once they’ve had enough, or gotten big enough to defend themselves. Too bad for this dad, he paid with his life.
Our judicial system is a joke. Let’s get some Boondock Saints up in this place
The kid knows he killed his dad. It’s not that complex. I feel bad for him though. Him saying it wouldn’t make a difference.
I think it was right that he didn’t need to do! After all, he’s just a little kid…
I don’t have kids and I don’t know enough about the mental capabilities to know what’s in his best interest… but he did kill his father. One day he’ll have to face that fact. This whole story just makes me very sad for the future of that little boy.
I think its scary that an 8 year old child was capable of committing murder…. to TWO grown men…
no
The truth of the matter is: Nobody can say with any amount of certainty what actually happened, save for a handful of people operating under a gag order. The confession the police elicited from him would NOT have been admissible in court; two of his Constitutional rights were violated in the process as well as a number of procedural regulations. Nevermind the fact that they used interrogation techniques regularly employed on adult offenders that have no place in an interview of a child. I would argue that the police mishandled the child from the first contact. He should have been handled by a psychiatrist with extensive experience in interviewing children who have witnessed traumatic events, as a witness initially and then as a suspect. The police took gross liberties with his Constitutional rights.
You cannot judge the child’s alleged actions without knowing the motivations and full circumstances involved.
What on earth was going on in that household that would possess a child to do, or heck, even know how to do such an awful thing?… wow.
I think he should have. That kid’s life wasn’t going to get any easier after he killed his dad, so why not? Plus, killing your dad because he spanked you too hard? Seriously, what the fuck is with us Americans now-a-days?
what difference does it make? he admitted it? that is what my boyfriend says, on the other hand for me… i think it would hurt worse because he has to realize every day his dad isnt with him and it’s his fault.
I think that is punishment enough.
I don’t think it’s right for them to force him to do or say anything he doesn’t want to, even though he is young.
Our justice system would fall apart if people got to choose their own fate. He killed someone; he should admit it.
Now, the question gets a lot more complicated when we start talking about consequences, but the answer to your question is he should admit it.
@mzsusan - He’s too young and most kids this age can’t handle the mental stress.
Like when young kids throw tantrums. They don’t know how to deal with it.
I work in the type of institution where these kinds of kids go. It does not matter if this child admits to killing his father or not…he faces a long road of therapy and problems.
@EmoPlayBunny - there was probably much, much more going on than just spanking. That particular incident of ‘spanking’ was probably what pushed him over the edge and that’s what he remembers, so that’s what he tells people. I would bet my paycheck that more was going on
Hm, this is hard to say whether it is good for the kid to say that or not.
I haven’t really get into this article so I am not really sure what’s the kid’s motivation for murdering.
But I don’t think it really matters if the kid actually admit the murder or not, because right now 8years old is a pretty critical age, and even if he didn’t kill the dad, he will think it’s his fault, and for the rest of his life he probably will have to deal w/ this guilt.
Yes. He did it, he should admit to it.
He knows what he did.
And he has to live with that.
Why make him announce it to the world?
I don’t think that’s the first instance of not wanting someone to admit to a crime because of the stigma that’s attached. I wonder if I could ask: Supposing they were prosecuted and convicted, do you think the American public should force Bush officials to admit to war crimes?
Some think that a soiled reputation is bad enough without also labeling
someone a “(murderer/someone who committed genocide/war criminal)”.
Was he black?
Yes.
What good will admitting it do? He knows he did it. Everyone else knows he did it.
I think there’s probably more to the issue than mere “spanking”, which is probably why they’re not releasing too many details and going (relatively speaking) soft on the kid. For all we know, he could have been the victim of sexual abuse (his victims were two grown men, after all) and, if so, he’ll have enough to deal with in the future without being an admitted murderer on top of everything else. It seems like perhaps the powers that be are trying to prevent him from becoming more “damaged” and more of a threat to society later on.
YES!!! It might be mean and cruel – but he took a life, heck, two lives. One life is not worth more than the other, which ever you take as the one that is worth more. He did the crime, but he’s not doing the time, “because of his age,” and now he won’t get the stigma either?
this is something a bunch of psychologists should think about.
Kudos to that little boy!
Parents who spank their kids are scumbags who deserve to die
I understand why abused people lash out. The boy may not be forced to admit it, but he knows the truth in himself. He did kill his father. It doesn’t matter if it’s said out loud or not. It will affect him for the rest of his life. Hopefully he can get the counseling and good strong support circle of friends and family to help him through life.
No. It would be hard enough to deal with it on his own…admitting it…idk…i just think it would make it worse.
Well, it’s better than having repressed memories. He’ll force himself to forget everything that happened and suddenly remember when he’s older and have even more problems.
he can lie to others, he can even lie in his prayers, but he can’t lie from himself. he’ll never have a normal life until he faces himself.
He knows he already killed his father. Isn’t that enough to hold someone back from EVER living a normal life?
No, I don’t think he should be forced. He’ll admit it when he’s ready. Even though he committed such a heinous crime, you still have to take into account that he’s still just a kid. There’s going to be a lot of psychological trauma involved, whether he’s forced to admit the killing of his father or not. Sadly, he’ll never live a normal life.
@BumbleBoTuna - Even then I think it’d be almost impossible for him to live a normal life. I mean, killing your parents? I can’t even fathom killing anyone, much less the people closest to me, my own blood. It’s truly horrifying.
I don’t know… it’s been a long time since both be or my siblings were 8 so I can’t judge…
Definitely.
Yes, he should be forced to admit it. His substance is more important than his age, and hiding the fact from himself is a recipe for more sociopathy – or whatever a good term is to fit him. He should be held fully responsible for his actions. It is more significant to me that he is a killer than that he is 8 years old.
Everyone should be held accountable for their actions, no matter what the actions or the age. No person who committed such a heinous crime will ever live a normal life, whether they admit it or not. It will always be on their conscience regardless. So i suppose he should admit it.
Whether he plead guilty to it or not: he did it.
Heaven forbid anyone should ever have to deal with REALITY……
@MorningAngel - u don’t know that though. why does it even matter, anyway? it’s just my opinion.
Yes. He has to confront- even at his age- the consequences of what he has done if he’s to have any hope at all in the future. If a child can, with cold premeditation, commit murder on his father for no more reason than that he was once spanked, then this is already a very dangerous person. Self-confession and firm moral guidance is indespensable at this point.
I’m really not sure o.O