March 21, 2011
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Women Should Submit To Their Husbands
Women would be so much happier in life if they just submitted to their husbands.
In the Bible we are taught in Ephesians 5:22-24, “Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.
Now we have the command that men are supposed to love their wives. And we teach that all the time. But no one wants to say with authority that women should submit to their husbands. We even water down what submission means by saying it means “respect.” But clearly the word means “obey.” The church is supposed to obey Christ. They are not supposed to just respect Him. The Bible tells children to submit to their parents. It does not just mean to “respect” them. It means to obey them.
But women rebel against this concept and they only hurt themselves. Women wanted to get out of the home and have freedom. This caused families to get used to two incomes. Now so many working women wish they could be back in the home. But so many women working outside the home has driven down the wages of men. So there is no way for them to go back into the home.
So many women are missing out on raising their little children. All of this because they were sold a lie by feminist. The lie was that they didn’t need a man and should not become dependent on a man. How is that working for you ladies?
Should women submit to their husbands?
Comments (228)
Decided to do some trolling again, eh Dan?
Meh.
I always obey whoever has the whip and fleshy impaling device.
You do understand that portion of the bible was written when society was like that, right? Why else would it feel so outdated compared to the modern age. Society changes.
I’m not sure if I like you using the bible in this manner. I can see why people hate christians..because they pick and choose their verses and try to make it how they please. That’s not how it’s suppose to be.
But I can see you are trolling..so I’ll leave it at that then.
You’re funny Dan. I’m a stay at home mom and am not dependent on my husband. I have my education that i can always fall back on. But every woman deserves to have the choice to work outside the home without being accused of submitting or not submitting.
It really depends how the wife is expected to submit, looking after the kids I feel every woman should do but being stopped for working or depreived of certain rights is not cool unless agreed upon mutually.
The book of Matthew says you should cut your hand off if it causes you to sin. You need hands to post blogs – would you like to borrow my hacksaw?
(most will say I should do the same)
How F***ing fascinating! Come closer and tell me more!
Only when fighting in an “I Quit” cage match
Yes, but it is not enough to say that wives should submit. This verse
is so easily taken out of context. The proper idea is that if the man
loves his wife (just as Christ loves the church) and the husband is in
the Will of the Father, then the wife will, understanding that her best
is at the forefront of her husband’s mind. There is no connotation of
the woman being inferior. There is nothing that says the wife can’t also
get a job.
In marriage though, the husband should be the leader
(again, if he loves his wife and is following Christ) and the wife
should be willing to respect and follow. However, this concept doesn’t
work extremely well if the husband is deadbeat/doesn’t love his wife/ is
abusive/ is otherwise incapable of properly leading his wife.
I would have to write a whole post on this simply to make what I’m saying understandable…
Ah yes. More proof that I’m right about things around here.
This is a joke, right? I am a SAHM and I’m lucky. I like staying at home and thankfully I can. Eventually I am going to pursue an art career. This doesn’t mean I am or am not submissive.
@VeritatisAmans - I get what you’re saying! I think Dan is bored.
@ShimmerBodyCream - I laughed so hard when I read this I shot milk out my nose. I wasn’t drinking milk.
just for the record… your therory on this is wrong. Due to human error actually. The beginning of that chapter SHOULD be the last verse in chapter 4. So it should start off like this:
21 Sumbit to one another out of reverence for Christ. 2 Wives Submit to your husbands as to the Lord. 3 For the husband is the head of the wife as Chris is the head of the church.
on to verse 23husbands loves your wives just as christ loved the church and have himself up for her.
Again due to human error, this begining of this chapter is incorrect. The Greek and Latin bibles prove this one.
Submit back in those times didn’t mean “RAWR SUBMIT TO ME!” it meant to love. Therefor your theory on this is incorrect.
UNLESSYou are just saying that because you are a kinky little bastard like me, your idea is off.
Panda~Gir
In the bedroom.
If this came from anyone else, I’d be supremely pissed off. But since it’s you, I’ll let it go because you’re clearly trolling.
An effective technique, casting assertions with no facts to back them up.
@GodlessLiberal - I thought this post was going to make my day…until I read your comment.
I don’t know that working outside the home (which I’m not big on either – a parent is the BEST person to raise a child, not a daycare worker, even if some of them are really good at what they do) can be grouped into obeying your husband.
I have to say – I LOVE my husband. So if he felt strongly enough on something and put his foot down about it (as long as I knew it wouldn’t hurt anyone or our family) I would definitely “submit” to my husband. I think you have to truly love & trust your husband to do that. And if you don’t – then why did you marry them in the first place?
Although I have to say, my husband has never told me what to do and hates the very idea of it (though he loves to jokingly order me around once in a while, adding “woman” on the end) – so I’ve never been in a position where I’ve had to submit to him. He’s definitely a good husband – not perfect, nowhere near. But his heart is usually in the right place.
Man, you’re going to get so much hate from this. I don’t think people realize that God sets forth rules & guidelines & examples for us to follow to help US, not to help him or be a dictator.
oh thats right, i forgot the man is always smarter. i guess thats why i forgot…
@xxSHhHxxBExxQUiETxx - I’m not sure if you’re saying that my comment instead made your day, or that my comment subsequently ruined it.
Do we really need more middle-aged mothers?
@Panda9490 -
Chris totally got screwed during the translation.
@VeritatisAmans - You have posted accurately, correctly and eloquently here already. He who has an ear let him hear.
Great job… here are my eprops. Though I feel rather squeamish at supporting trolls…
I’ll submit when man alone can provide more than enough for the whole family. I don’t think it’s fair to say that because women work men can’t provide as much? Or did I misunderstand… Besides during those times… and in that part of the world women were and probably to an extent still submit… darn feminism and all their ideals… women with equal rights, what were they thinking… We should be there to rub or husbands backs when they get home… clean the house, watch the kids, and have 3 cooked meals a day although kids and husband would only be there for dinner…
@whataboutbahb - Christ or Chris?
I don’t see it happening in America that often but in other cultures it is a hard and fast rule. I am glad my husband loves and respects me enough to find a mutual way. But if I can at all see doing it, I generally do what he ASKS.
@ShimmerBodyCream - Oh Summer.
Jeez, Dan, you just can’t resist stirring things up, can you?
i think women rebeled against the command of submission because men weren’t upholding their part of the command “husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies…” of course two wrongs don’t make a right. bleh. marriage is a difficult thing, not for the faint of heart.
@Hinase - While I do not necessarily agree with this entry, which is most likely a guest blog, I also disagree with what you’re saying. Society, for the purposes of this conversation, hasn’t changed much in America. Men and Women still get married and have children and more often than not it is still the woman at home taking care of them and the man being the breadwinner. Do you have a problem with that?
Wow..well my husband refused to get an education that would allow for him to have a better paying job other than mcdonalds. so i had to work instead of staying home with our daughter. then my said husband decided to have an affair. then he left his family because he wanted to have fun. so now i am a single mom working and going to school full time. i would LOVE to be home with my daughter, but I have to provide for her because no one else will. We don’t always have the choice. If a man beats his wife, should she stay with him and let him beat her because a wife is suppose to obey her husband?
@jenessa1889 - Hey, it’s not that men are smarter. Families need a decider just like America does. What better decider than the one that is hormonally inclined to be more impulsive?
@GodlessLiberal - LOL, I didn’t realize it could be taken two ways. I meant your comment made my day instead.
times have changed. would you tell a victim of domestic violence to submit to her abusive husband?
heh my wife DOES submit…. she submits to me a list every day of “yes dears”… i say “yes dear” and do them …sighs…
so many women working outside the home has driven down the wages of men
I am curious what you have to back up that statement.
Also if you be quoting the Bible:
She considereth a field, and buyeth it: with the fruit of her hands she planteth a vineyard.17. She girdeth her loins with strength, and strengtheneth her arms.18. She perceiveth that her merchandise is good: her candle goeth not out by night.
A Business Woman?
So long as he understands “submit” does NOT mean, “take my load in the face like a good Christian wife and/or in the butt, for this is the will of the Lord.”
@beforedawn - lol. I know how that goes.
I wonder why the conversation hasn’t gone to the idea of equal rights in context of the Bible saying what men and women should do. That part of Ephesians is not saying women shouldn’t have the right to not submit to their husbands, but only that this should be the proper role in marriage. It also isn’t saying that a husband must love his wife like Christ loves the church but that he should be willing to lay down his life for his wife. In context of women’s rights, there is a big difference between must and should. To be honest, I see this whole instruction as more like guidelines, because a woman should not have to stay with a husband that beats her, cheats on her, or generally treats here like crap. Then again, if a husband loved his wife as Christ loves the church then I imagine these verses imply the husband would still love her despite being treated like crap.. etc. I guess I have always interpreted this as holding a higher standard to the man, though this standard is rarely taken as seriously as it should be while failure by men is much more acceptable, even popularized, in our society.
There’s not one peice of philosophy that can create an entirely general universal code of conduct for any aspect of our life… it depends on the family. That’s that. Sometimes there are relationships in which the husband should obey the wife because the wife is just better at being a leader.
But the whole bit about women driving men’s wages down is so whack. Women going into the workforce is what saved the economy during WWII. If you don’t want your woman to work, mary a lazy woman.
Plus, expecting a woman to submit to her husband doesn’t really make a lot of room for compromise, and isn’t that what a good relationship is about?
@pinktiger335 - ”like”
@thetruthhurts444 - Read my first post in this. It will explain it better.
Ok I am a Woman and I am not a christian or any other “religion” for that matter and in my own opinion the woman not obeying the man is the cause of the breakdown of society as we know it. If the homes were as they were in the 50′s where the man had the final word and the moms were home when the kids were out of school there would be less school bullies, less school shootings, higher grades, fewer divorces and it goes on and on. Of course the men need to step up and make it so. They have let feminists rule for far too long. I say brake out the whip, dress and heels and put us in our place. Bring back the father knows best and leave it to beaver households and the women who dont like it can find somewhere else to live. Yea i know this is rude. I take a very firm stand on the fact that the man is the man and the woman should obey him. end of discussion. to be a good gf or wife you need to 1. obey 2. clean like a maid 3. love w all your heart 4. be a tramp in the bedroom (only for your man). just a lil hint for you single ladies who are having trouble finding a man.
Troll!
He will work along side me equally Or I will deny him any dessert!
@striemmy - No. You completely missed my point. Of course people still do that, I have no problem with that. I’m talking about him saying that women should submit to their husbands for everything and I know that a lot of society has changed and in some aspects and women don’t really have to do that at least in the western world. That’s what I’m talking about. I think he’s just trolling more than anything.
@xxSHhHxxBExxQUiETxx - OK, awesome. You’re welcome!
I will probably be stoned for saying this but i actually agree with some of this IF one can find a leader respect/trust worthy, self sacrificing etc. to submit to. I definitely think women should be treated with respect and kindness, tenderness and consideration in return though.
every couple is different/ have different needs, and I don’t think women must stay home with kids or live under strict rule,but the right guy would love his wife more than his own self, be self sacrificing, honest, faithful, respectful, caring, etc.
Lame. I’d rather get a divorce before “submitting to the authority of my husband”
As always, a post meant to be humorous yet abrasive enough to will people to responding. That is exactly what the text reads and it just goes to show how society was back then (still?). Rarely are women mentioned in the Bible and even more rare is it favorably. Considering the suffrage struggles for women in America less than 100 years ago, it’s small wonder a book translated and edited over thousands of years would tell women to be submissive.
yes, wives should submit to their husbands, but they should submit to God first. And husbands have to love their wives like Christ loved the church, so they should always think for the wife’s best interests and act on them. If necessary, he would have to jump in front of a train to save her.
I’ll wear my maid outfit and gladly submit to Jude Law
eh. Id rather be a successful wife, mother and clinician. I believe I can do it all. Or at least Id try my damn best.
Boy, that was a handful to swallow
I say no.
By reading the title: I couldn’t agree more.
Umm… I literally don’t need a man… It’s not a lie and my situation works just fine for me. If I want children, there’s artificial insemination. Men can’t say they can do it on their own like that, can they?
i should unsubscribe. you are just way too sexist for my liking.
I am one to say Amen !
People today are too greedy and too selfish to understand the meaning of “servant.” The husband is the servant of the wife, as Christ set the example of what it means to serve others. The wife must be submissive to the husband, but must never allow herself to be treated in a way that degrades her. For points of reference check out what happened in Esther 1 and how the king, taking bad advice from drunken friends, destroyed his relationship with the queen. No woman should be treated in such a manner. A husband must love his wife and treat her with dignity and honor.
And women must lose the thought that it is insulting to be called “lady.” Being a lady is a reachable standard. Shame that feminism destroyed the positive light in which men and women used to look at each other.
Every institution must have someone who is in charge. Otherwise there is chaos. That the man must provide leadership in the family does not mean he lords it over his wife or that he has license to be abusive and give orders. Leaders lead by example, wisdom and by serving the people in their charge.
Being a good husband has to be a very tough job. And yes, a wife must submit to her husband.
That’s why I’m still single. I haven’t found a man who is worthy of my submission.
@LoBornlytesThoughtPalace - lol still not sure if you aint a man…
@VeritatisAmans - Great answer! Now I don’t need to post one… fantastic job.
It is not a command to abuse power, it is a way to resolve certain issues. In life, one must be able to make a final decision, and with only 2 making the decision, there cannot be a majority rule. SO After taking into consideration under LOVING circumstances, if there is not agreement between husband and wife, it is the husbands responsibility to chose. In that situation, the wife is to submit. Are all men able to decide such things well, and in correct, and loving manners? NO. Then maybe the women didn’t do too well in choosing their mate. Kind of like hiring into a job with a crappy boss. One may not get to decide under his/her management, or even to discuss possibilities. Then, sooner or later you’ll most likely move on.
Do you really believe this, Dan? Honestly?
Yes.
Hmm.. I’m not sure about women driving down men’s wages.. In many cases, female employees are paid less than their male counterparts and it is HARD for women to get to the top (unless you’re extremely talented and hardworking). At least in most Asian countries it is. However, inflation causes everything to be more expensive and one income is not enough.
On another note, what happens if the woman is the breadwinner? There could be a lot of reasons why the husband can’t find a job (especially during recession like now).. So the women make the main income and the husband stay at home. Now.. Does that mean the husband has to “submit” to the wife? I mean.. She makes the money, right, so decisions should be more to her liking?
A lot of people, men and women, grimace at this teaching. I am always dismayed that they forget to read on to the next couple of passages where Paul tells men that they must love their wives like CHRIST loves the CHURCH; talk about a high standard! No pressure, guys!
Hahahaha. Yeah, right. That was the same verse used at the freaky wedding I just blogged about. I laughed then too.
Unless I’m mistaken, Jesus said first to take the log out of your own eye first and then worry about the speck in your brother’s eye (or sister’s as the case may be.) If husbands were responsible leaders of the home, men that their wives could depend on unquestionably, then women wouldn’t be forced to do every bloody thing there is to do. I know whereof I speak.
@VeritatisAmans - ehh i kind of get what you’re saying. and it makes sense. and if men didn’t abuse the leading thing then i think it would work fine. i’m pretty dependent upon my husband but he doesn’t abuse it. he treats me equal to him.
I have an illustration that might serve as a metaphor of how this principle was meant to function (in a perfect world). Yesterday afternoon my husband was sleeping because he had worked a shift the night before. The kids and I had just finished lunch and I felt that a little nap was in order. I went upstairs; got comfortable and crawled into bed next to my husband. He rolled over; greeted me with a smile and I laid my head on his chest in that perfectly wonderful spot that’s always there for it.
I snuggled in close; told him I loved him and that I wanted to lay my head there for a minute and shut my eyes. He kissed my head and I fell asleep almost immediately. 30 minutes later I woke up. He had put his hand on my head to stroke my hair. It occurred to me that he had just been laying there not wanting to disturb me and enjoying the moment (?). I asked him if he’d been awake and he admitted that he was. I felt bad that he didn’t move on my account. If you knew my husband, you’d know he is not the type to sit still for very long.
I think this passage speaks of this type of relationship. The woman is actually the initiator in her submission. God is telling her to do it. The husband isn’t demanding it.It’s something the woman is willing to do naturally for love, comfort and safety. It’s appealing not repulsive to her.The husband’s response is one of joy and wanting to serve her needs as he sees her coming to him eagerly with a spirit of trust in her heart.
This verse does not demand a mindless commitment contrary to how God designed our wants and desires. Such as, “I know this is difficult guys and gals but it’s kind of like medicine… it tastes awful but it’s good for ya”
Now I don’t think you can extrapolate from this verse. Ladies, don’t work; or do anything else contrary to the will of a demanding husband.My point in this illustration is only meant to show that God intends a strength and a pleasure to the marriage bond that works beautifully within the framework of submission. I think fear, cynicism and the very real nature of our selfish behavior can screw up a really great principle and we usually end up arguing about the “what if’s” while missing the beauty of what God intended.
@the_rocking_of_socks - Well, I guess just as long as a chauvinist prick is TROLLING, he can say anything he wants. How sad that one troll receives encouragement and a permanent place on top blogs while others are castigated. Hypocrites, all of you.
I do in the sack, but thats about it. I’m too much of an independent mind to ever consider such a thing.
Even the picture in this post shows the woman in the dominating position, her head higher than the man’s, her eyes open while his are closed, she is in an aggressive posture with her arms on him, possessing him, instead of his wrapped around her.
If I were the kind of woman who would marry a man like you, I would definitely submit.
How about a post from Mrs. Dan?
Haha. You know it’s funny, cuz men are now submitting to women. What do you think all of this pussy-whipping is?
It’s funny cuz I know women would be totally offended by this suggestion, while completely ignoring the fact that they’ve had it good with all this man-submission since the advent of feminism.
But really, do I want women to ‘submit’ to me, or if I was a husband, to ‘submit’ to me? Absolutely not. I just don’t want to have to ‘submit’ to her to where I’m paying for everything, getting slapped in the back of the head if I do something that she deems as ‘bad’, or have to deal with bitching about a toilet seat or something like that. Simply put, I won’t stand for male disrespect. Unfortunately that’s not going to help me get in a relationship or maintain a relationship considering how entitled 100% of these American girls are when it comes to being treated like princesses.
I’m a woman… what if I want to marry a woman? Who’s supposed to submit then? Just curious.
@yan_ni - ”what happens if the woman is the breadwinner?”
The woman divorces the man, that’s what happens. No woman would be in a relationship like that. Or I suppose I should say ‘very few’… To the point where the percentage is negligent. And the ones that do exist like this usually has the woman complaining to the man about how inadequate she views him.
Someone get me a gun, it’s time to REVOLT! TIME TO REUNITE THOSE MEN WITH GOD, CAUSE THEYRE STEALING ALL THE FUC*ING JOBS!
@VeritatisAmans - This is roughly what I was going to post. But my intent was going to be much longer and… this totally suffices for now.
The problem is that not every man is “loving”. In the older generations you can see that men take the “submit” thing too far and become abusive. Women should have the right to work, and make the same wages as men. But they should have the right to stay home with their kids, too… and live on their own steam before they are married. A woman should not have to live with her parents or husband. The happiest relationships are the ones where both people have the option to leave, but they choose to stay together, because they WANT to. Going the other way, I think that if a man wants to stay home and raise their kids, and the woman wants to support the household, they should have the right to… Though less are inclined to. As divorce and single parenthood becomes more common, it is becoming less and less that we need two incomes just to survive. We just have an exceptionally spoiled standard of living.
Haha. Ridiculous.
I actually stay home at the moment, but I just returned to school so we can enjoy two wages. But maybe I just don’t care because I’m not religious, and neither is my husband, so I’ve never been asked “to obey” anything.
Dan = troll.
@beforedawn - LowBrowThoughtlessPalace’s name is Curtis.
http://celestial-teapot.xanga.com/739127035/lobornlyte-is-a-man-and-i-can-prove-it/
It’s pretty idiotic for him to even try to keep up the ruse after such a conclusive investigation. See link above.
@Blind_Paraplegic -
Hmmm.. Not quite.. Actually, my sister is the breadwinner inher house.. She had always made more money than my bro-in-law because she’s simply smarter and more aggressive. That doesn’t mean she’s not a good mother, though. She comes home and helps out in the house. Takes care of the children well. My bro-in-law on the other hand, doesn’t work because he quit it by choice. He wanted to do his own business, discussed it with my sis, and both agreed to the decision. The only thing is that its still in start up phase, so definitely no income (probably more expenses made, even) and it’s been a year. In the daytime, my bro in law stays home and takes care of the kids and the house (well, even if he doesn’t do it as well as a woman would). But see, they’re pretty much a strong couple.
Anyway.. Just wanted to see how people will react if the scenario was reversed.
Ps. Divorce, in many cases/societies, is still a less preferable choice. Especially when kids are involved.
@LoBornlytesThoughtPalace -
I like you already. Lol
1. false assumption from “women submitting to husbands” to “women staying at home”
2. could there be value in this verse – as women submitting to a man who already has her wishes at heart anyway – in a society where the main message about gender and sexual relations was that men ought to be trustworthy toward women and women ought to trust men?
Women have to work. If we didn’t, there would be no intelligence in the workplace. We can’t have that. D;
I dislike whatever feminist says a man being polite to a woman (like opening the door) is sexist. I for one don’t mind special treatment. I also like to run around without shoes and climb trees in a very un lady like fashion and know more about cars than the average boy my age. Being strong and independent does not have to be synonymous with superior. Submitting to your husband does not have to be synonymous with inferior. I have a slightly rebellious attitude but I keep it in check for two reasons: for the sake of whatever job I might have even if makes me mad and 2. for my husband. He treats me well and I try to return the favor, it’s as simple as that. We don’t throw around nasty words like “submission” and “obey” and “dominate.” We’re nice to each other and so far, it’s working out really well. I pretend like I won’t do what he says but for the most part I do. I do my best and I feel absolutely no twinge of humiliation because I know he appreciates and understands every little things I so (sounds dumb and naive I know but don’t hate, I found me a good one).
Women have to be who they are. One can make the choice to submit to her husband, and be with a man who is worthy. Such a man will treat his wife like a Queen. If such a woman loves her husband, children, family and home enough to reject the workforce, she and her household can be happy and fulfilled.
Women who don’t want such a thing can’t be made to want it. Either way, to force a woman to be what she is not or to promote a life that she finds repugnant is a horrible thing. When women (and people in general) are forced to be and do what they don’t want to do, everyone pays – especially the *born* children.
I do agree, women should submit to their husbands, but that has nothing to do with whether or not they work outside the home. That has nothing to do with it.
This was also written in a different time and a different society. Back when men could be a Man and Lead their wife and children. Step up and be a Man and your wife will submit to you. Follow God and do what is truly right and she will submit to you and love you and be everything she needs to be for you and your family.
Women are strong, I’m not saying we aren’t. But they are not as strong as men. We are not supposed to be, We don’t have to be, we were not made to be stronger. Sure we can be when men are wimpy and can’t hold up to the standards that they should be able to, but life happens.
God needs to be the center of the relationship. And everything else will work out right.
@bakersdozen2 says it amazingly
I’ve picked up on the fact that you don’t have to say much You just let your followers argue it out.
. . . Women are also having fewer children now than they used to, so they don’t necessarily need to stay home taking care of seven children any more. The average American mother only has two children. Also, unlike in biblical times, nearly all of these children (even girls!) are being sent to school, which is roughly seven hours a day mothers aren’t with their children. Hey, guess what? That’s roughly a work day, give or take an hour or two.
shouldn’t this post be preceded by a post about how men today mostly don’t fit to be a husband?
I am so opposite of a feminist, am I the only one who would absolutely love not having to work or make decisions? I’d get along so well in the 50s haha
Our society has an attitude that submission is demeaning. So we keep vital parts of ourselves to ourselves. We never truly cleave with our spouses. We set ourselves up for divorces because we don’t become one. When you truly give of yourself to your spouse a mutual submission occurs where both would literally lay down their lives for the other. It is hard to see or have this kind of relationship if self is always first. A trust builds between husband and wife if your husband knows “you’ve got his back” and you as a wife know that your husband has your’s.
The statement about working mothers is true. I grew up with a very feminist mother. She felt when I “gave up my career” to stay home and raise my children, that this is a demeaning waste of my time, as if children having a mom at home isn’t very important. Husbands are treated pretty much the same way. Our society encourages moms to get over that feeling of not wanting to leave your brand new baby in the care of others. Some moms say they can not stay home with their kids because they will drive them crazy. Our “Progression” has pushed us towards divorces and broken homes over the past few generations. Marriage and children can cause growth in your life if you choose to allow it. You can become bitter or better.Submission is not a bad thing. Some people taking that the wrong way and abusing people with it, is by no means a reason to rid the sound biblical concept altogether.
…….my $0.02
Oh hell no:):)
The Bible is as relevant today as it was back when it was written. We as a people are so caught up in our own narcissism that we couldn’t possibly believe that we’re supposed to be “below” someone else.
I will always submit to my husbands wisdom. I will always respect his decisions. And our marriage flourishes because of it.
LOLOL up to stirring shit up again huh? I took a peek at the post not because of the topic itself, but knowing that the topic itself would get some people all riled up
It works out if you’re melted. Men just make me cranky because they are competing with me. It prevented me from having a family because I don’t have security, which causes me to restrict (it’s a reaction that females have, and you all do).
Equal women’s rights have destroyed us. Enjoy the cupcake, bitch.
I’ still looking for a better lord. lol you can’t stop evolution.
@truered13 - You’re kidding, right?
I believe that the only person you will ever be able to fully count on is yourself – and I don’t necessarily mean that every one will let you down..but even in an instance in which everything is great, and woops, your significant other dies….then what? Yeah…you’re screwed. If I could not work and volunteer my time to various places in place of that…I would love it, but in no way am I giving up my ability to control my future and I feel as though unless I change my focus from personality traits to money in the bank, its unlikely I’m going to find someone who can support not only my lifestyle and what I want, but their lifestyle also on just their income.
I do like domestic arts though..you know..cooking, cleaning, sewing, etc.
Psh. My boyfriend’s my bitch
you guys don’t really get it
God created man first he got all the responsiblilty not the woman if you seriously look at it the guy has a lot of weight to pull supporting a family
i grew up in a single income family dad’s job was to be head of the household and main breadwinner mom homeschooled and stayed home with us (kids)
there can be (and probly are) families with dual incomes that the wife is submissive having a job doesnt always have anything to do with it the point is that the man has decision making responsibilities that need someone less emotional to make women cant always do that
also the man because he makes all the decisions he has the harder judgement at the great white throne and if he made wrong decisions IT’S HIS FAULT!!!!!!!!!
however if the wife was submissive and supportive she wont be judged as hard because we each take responsibility for our actions if the husband is abusive or stiff like that the first thing a wife should do is PRAY
a submissive wife isnt always a SAHM or that she is a helpmeet how God designed in that particular relationship
THERE ARE NO COOKIE CUTTERS!!!!!!
we have to let God be original with everyone so submission isnt always going around saying i cant work or do anything because i have to be submissive
“Yes, but it is not enough to say that wives should submit. This verse
is so easily taken out of context. The proper idea is that if the man
loves his wife (just as Christ loves the church) and the husband is in
the Will of the Father, then the wife will, understanding that her best
is at the forefront of her husband’s mind. There is no connotation of
the woman being inferior. There is nothing that says the wife can’t also
get a job.
In marriage though, the husband should be the leader
(again, if he loves his wife and is following Christ) and the wife
should be willing to respect and follow. However, this concept doesn’t
work extremely well if the husband is deadbeat/doesn’t love his wife/ is
abusive/ is otherwise incapable of properly leading his wife.
I would have to write a whole post on this simply to make what I’m saying understandable…”
This was written so eloquently and represents my exact thoughts, I reposted it!
Thanks, Dan.
Lisa.
Anybody who really thinks that marriages should be like this, are just a bunch of morons…there’s really no other way I can put it. It’s as simple as that.
If I remember correctly the Bible also says that a man should love his wife the very same way that Jesus loves the church. So in that case there should be no bad treatment, lack of compassion, or self serving thoughts from the man toward the woman. Correct?? Sounds like men are the first not to live up to that standard if thats the case. Keep in mind I don’t believe much of the Bible to be true nor the word of a God. I’m not Christian nor any other faith so this entire blog is really moot for me.
Women are between a rock and a hard spot. Even after my divorce I continue to stay home and raise my two small children. I thought it was important to stay with them at least until they entered school…. and so I am sticking to my beliefs as long as it is possible. I’m willing to give up other things to do so.
However, there are plenty of times when I wish I’d gotten a college education prior to having children so I’d fair a better chance in the workforce later on. More often than I was told, “good for you for being a SAHM.” I am expected to work 40hrs a week, throw my kids in daycare for $1000-$1200 per month, and get some college classes in on the side as well. IMO… for ME I’d feel like I abandoned my kids if doing all of those things when they are still young wasn’t necessary to provide for them.
These days women are expected to do everything and play every part. It wasn’t all feminism. Gaining basic rights as a human being was worth whatever downsides may have come with it. Back in the day many men couldn’t work enough to provide so women took on some of that responsibility while still being a keeper of home and caring for children. Sometimes the husband falls ill, dies, or leaves. Would anyone expect that the woman quickly move on to the nearest suiter or that she refuse to use her skills or abilities to provide in the absence of a husband? The economy will have ups and downs regardless of who is in the workforce. You can blame the lows on a lot of things if you try hard enough.
What about singe mothers, widows, women who don’t have and will never have children, women with partners who can’t provide financially for whatever reason, gay couples, women who want to remain single, etc. The world isn’t straight forward.
When people realize that their lives are never going to live up to a set of rules none of us even understand to begin with we’ll be a lot better off. When you take religion out of the equation it’s a lot less cloudy. So many years of being told what to do and how to act further than manners, compassion, and self respect has detached us from being able to make decision on our own that don’t make things even worse. We’re out of touch with our own sense of right from wrong and whats best for us on an individual basis. Sad. Few can be trusted these days. Self serving. I don’t see the Bible helping matters much. *shrug*
not sure if i still want to be your friend.
Really, Dan? The Bible also says that men should not look at women with lust in their hearts. How does your wife feel about your hypocrisy?
@VeritatisAmans - I love that you clarified this and the way that you clarified this. I have see this “submitting” text taken to one extreme to another and its really rather old. There is always some one out there (usually a man) who tries to use this to his advantage. I have been in bad relationships, abusive relationships, where the man tried to use this on me, I have been in relationships where the man was just all willy nilly with the money, was not responsible in any way and there is no way that I am submitting to that b/c he does not have my best interest at heart and therefore would never have our future children’s best intentions either.
However, if you find a true Godly man, there is something to be said of submitting to him but that does not mean that you don’t voice your opinion, he should respect you enough to want your opinion, your advice, you guidance at time as no one is perfect all the time. A true relationship of God is a partnership in that way that you both lean upon each other with your eyes on God. Will you always agree on the right thing to do, no. Will he get it right all the time, no, but if his heart is in the Lord then there is no reason to fear.
Amen to you for saying it correctly!
@Angieprays - Not to mention SAHM’s are working. We just like our “colleagues” better.
When men stop cheating, and abandoning their children then we can talk about submission.
Don’t forget the line that comes right after that says “Husbands submit to your wives.”
i somewhat i agree. i like that i have say in my relationship. but there’s no denying who is the boss. my man!
You’re such an asshole! I actually was raised to believe this and did submit to my first husband. My first husband who corrupted me, lied to me and cheated on me more times than i can count. You can not blame all the changes on women. If men treated their wives right, then maybe the way things were, would still be. I personally would of done fine being taken care of financially and I was a stay at home wife and mother of my children, which is what i wanted at the time.
What changed me is my husband’s behavior. He wanted me to get “my own life” as he called it. So why did he beg for me to marry him?? if he wanted me to have my own life?? Because he was lost and confused. I trusted a man who broke me morally and spiritually. It changed me for life. I compromised myself and my beliefs because of being submissive to him. I became the party animal he always wanted and the whore too.
I often wish it was more accepted to live like back in the days where ladies were treated like ladies and men brought home the bacon. These changes are not one sex’s fault alone. You just did this post to get hits on your page.
LOL yeah I mean what are we doing on the Internet? We should get back into the kitchen.
Only if men aren’t to masturbate or play football….ever…
thats funny, i came from a culture that traditionally devalues and objectifies women as much perhaps even more than any monotheism, confucius is a big misogynist y’all. ever since liberation women had more rights and showed, all the women in my life, my mom, grandmothers, aunts grandaunts who are in perfectly happy long term marriages are not at all submissive, some are outspoken and a bit rowdy. it is always an equal partnership.
@Hinase - This.
Why should anyone care about a book written a couple thousand years ago, anyway? Read Harry Potter or something, at least it has a little more truth in it.
i agree with you and i am glad that there is someone still blogging the truth and not the world’s version that so many people are used to following. I think it is good that you are getting resistance in all these comments. God’s word causes resistance to the ones not following it because they don’t want to admit that they are doing wrong. I am not saying women should not work outside the home but I definitely think they are missing out on raising their kids. and many have to in order to survive in this world we live in. but i definitely think too often women are way to defiant to their husbands, this was not written so men could control women and anyone that speaks this message needs to make that clear. it is written to protect the woman, to keep true the sanctity of marriage that God wanted, and to keep the woman happy. but so many are too hardheaded to see this.
No thanks. I think I would rather prefer an equal relationship where neither of us is really submissive so to speak. This is the modern age welcome to the future.
@LetsTripTheLightFantastic - simple answer because this book won’t send you to hell it will save you from it actually.
I love how you just jump right back in and land on top!
I will begin to say that I believe women do deserve freedom to learn how to depend on themselves. First of all, if they were to depend on men, how would they find the right one and know for sure the guys will be there to take care of the women?
Secondly, what does that leave for the women welfare? Does that mean they need to live with parents until marriage? Third, I believe that if they have learned how to depend on themselves, they will be capable of knowing what to do if something happened to the men in their lives, like if one died or left, women are prepared. I believe in having more than one income in homes, because the prices are just too high for one person to afford, unless you made A LOT of money.If I was to live on my own again, plus three, I would never be able to afford it. The rent is more than what I made. Sadly, these days men are not as strong as they may have been in the past. And I think men have liked the idea of women having their own sources of income and support if something happened to themselves. What if the guy got fired, loses a job? Imagine how stressful it is alone to support a family WITH a job than it is without.
@VeritatisAmans - I agree.
I hate how men tell their wives to submit to them, yet act like ruthless dictators in the meantime, thinking they deserve said submission. Not so. I see it as a submission of two people, the wife follows the husband and “obeys” him, so long as he follows Christ and loves her. Love requires submission, it requires a person to accept the fact that they may get hurt, that they have to put their guard down, but that this is worth it. The husband has to love the wife, for the wife to follow him. It’s a submission that happens WHEN the husband meets these conditions, not IF they meet them. In a sense, you’re both equals once these conditions are met. There are accomodations both parties have to make for this submission to take place.
happiness is overrated. Which isn’t to say its important, but it’s silly to base our belief systems or actions around the concept of “happy.” I won’t argue that many women probably are “happier” in this situation, because it’s probably true. But that’s irrelevant really. It doesn’t mean any woman can and will be happy in that arrangement; rather, it suggests that those who would find it happy have already gravitated towards developing those relationship structures.
And honestly ignorance is truly bliss if we’re talking about happiness just based on whether we feel good or bad about the world. When we are not given the power to make choices/someone else is in control of our major life choices, if the outcome of these choices are relatively pleasant we will be happy because there is very little stress on our part. We don’t have to ponder alternatives because none are given. But I would rather have choice and the stress and worry that comes with the autonomy of my own soul, than the happiness that comes with submitting to someone else and relinquishing my power to make choices.
hoping this entire post is a joke.
@VeritatisAmans - “and the wife should be willing to respect and follow”. women do not need to be “led” by anyone, as we too have our own mind/desires as well as the ability to decide what is best for ourselves and lead ourselves in whichever direction we choose. Christianity often makes women sound like docile, lost little sheep. it’s no wonder i’m not a Christian. – __ -
The Bible also said that shellfish is an abomination, and that you should own slaves. Do you do believe either of those things? If you don’t, you are a bad Christian.
also to be honest I pretty much read your first line or two and figured I knew where the post was going, but actually I didn’t. Is this satire or something? I hope so. If people want to live that way I’m fine with that- as a feminist I have to support people living their lives as they want to and not as some nebulous “other” dictates.
But
I really question your statistics. The image of the woman being a house mom after marriage is a bit of a myth; we have had two-income households since waaay before the advent of the feminist revolution. And feminism did not bring women down; it gave them a voice and it gave power to those who had none. In all reality world war 2 was the large determinant in the workplace reconfiguration.
But what bothers me about this myth of sorts is that it’s rather privileged; how many of us envision a middle class white woman when we think of, “1950′s woman raising the family at home?” Because that is why this is a myth; if I assume this post to be about women everywhere, and not just in America, then we must acknowledge that 2 income households have been a necessity in most parts of the world for a long, long time. In all reality the people who have been able to afford a one-income nuclear family household have always been few and far between. Women have always been a part of the international workforce; the only difference now is that they are more visibly so.
@onjerusalemhill - Agreed.
A female did not write the bible. . .apparently. . .
I guess you were there when the scripture was written in it’s original language. And you are probably completely fluent in Aramaic, Latin and Greek so you know how much the translations have affected the way scripture is presented today. And you taken into account that there were female deacons in early Christian history. (Men by default would have to submit to female leadersship) So I guess you know better than me. You’re not narrow-minded or backwards at all. You’ve in fact founded the panacea to cure all the problems of the world. Forget about Esther, Joan of Arc or other female leaders. Women should only have one role in society and that role should be characterized by submission. Thank you so much for your ultimate manly wisdom!
@FREETOLOSE - If you think I meant anything about ‘docile, lost sheep’ then you misunderstood me. No one should ‘lead themselves’ when in a marriage. It’s a union. Two becoming one. You can’t have two parts of the body going two separate ways, therefore, there must be a leader. Does that mean the wife doesn’t do anything she wants? No, of course not! But when it comes to having a family, raising them, deciding what’s best for the unit, there SHOULD be leadership and there SHOULD be mutual agreement and understanding. The husband can’t just do whatever he pleases and expect the wife to blindly agree and follow. BUT the same is true of the wife, she can’t think of only herself and what she wants. The man is no longer his own person, he is his wife’s. The woman is no longer her own person, she is her husband’s. In this way (implementing a proper, LOVING mindset), the leadership of the husband SHOULD never lead his wife where she does not want to go and should only serve for the betterment of the family. Christ is our leader, but He led with much humility, often times more as a Servant than as Master. There is no domineering in this leadership. It is of love.
@Cookies678 - And can you explain to us what the role of a deaconess was? It was marked by servitude, but I don’t guess that fits well with your understanding of it. And I don’t understand how Esther was a leader. She was a great woman, no doubt about it. But I recall her petitioning her husband several times…By the way, he wasn’t addressing a woman’s role in society. He was addressing the woman’s role in a marriage.
@the_peach_assailant - The bible doesn’t say you SHOULD own slaves. Also, you’re taking the law out of context when concerning shellfish (and most other OT laws).
@cubancutiepie - Very well said
@yourkbear - It’s not lust in the context of marriage, just as sex is not ‘fornication/adultery/sexual immorality’ in the context of marriage.
@Thoughts_of_Motherhood - Completely agree with everything you said. The things God wants for us do not change with time, like so many think. He set these guidelines to protect through all times. But WE are greedy we will always want more.
@VeritatisAmans - I was going to address many of the people you already did but you have handled it all so well i will let you have it!!
I pretty much agree with this.
=)
and with VeritatisAmans =)
@yan_ni - LowBrowThoughtlessPalace is a man. Well, he was apparently born with man parts, but he’s rather unfit to be called a man in the full sense of the word.
http://celestial-teapot.xanga.com/739127035/lobornlyte-is-a-man-and-i-can-prove-it/
…
Were there not any fascinating current news topics today?
@VeritatisAmans - Obviously. I did not mean within his marriage. Thus, the reason his wife would possibly have any negative feelings about it.
Cool story, bro.
@yourkbear - Ah, I apologize. I misunderstood
Submit doesn’t equal Obey. I could write about the different natures of men and women, but I think y’all probably don’t need another lecture on that. Submission occurs when you are in relationship with another person and you freely give over the authority within that relationship to the other person. It puts the male and female on the same level, with the woman, out of love, allowing the male to be the head. The male, by not being stubborn, hard-headed or dominating, loves his wife by never forcing himself to be the head, but rather being the leader through servant-hood. Ideally, both act out of love towards the other. Obeying someone infers that the authority has already placed on the other person and you are acting out of obligation and not out of choice, because it is your duty. When the verse speaks of children obeying their parents, it does not say that children should submit to their parents…ever. It says that they should obey their parents in the Lord.
You’re right, feminism is harmful. Not because of taking the woman out of the home and away from the children (necessarily), but because it has caused a “me vs. them” mentality (women vs. men). All of a sudden it has become about what I (as a woman) deserve and what can I do to be recognized and given the credit that I deserve, while what is best for the people around me gets forgotten because I’m too selfish to realize that I am not my own universe. *random rant* Political correctness makes everything so narrow-minded and complicated…blurg.
The End.
Men should submit to their wives.
Only if the man is the perfect man who knows his wife wel, is intelligent and loving and is able to make decisions which benefit the both of them properly, but the same applys the other way round … so no.
Whether this is satire or anyone’s actual point of view, I despise it. I’ll crack a very rare joke about women belonging in the kitchen or whatever, but when it comes down to it. I feel very strongly that as a general point all people are equal.
@VeritatisAmans - Of course the role of the deconess is marked by servitude, all church leadership is. Even Christ made a point of washing the apostles feet and told them to serve the people this way. My point is that those roles are leadership roles and thus men and women had to submit to them. Secondly, of course Esther had to petition her husband. Marriage is about compromise between both partners. That’s no surprise to me. And if he was the big honcho why is she so famous and people have to google who the heck he is?
And the poster’s blog may have mainly been about marriage but that goes hand in hand with women’s role in society since he attacks feminism and wives and mothers in the workplace.
I’m just making the point that women have been leaders that men have submitted to so why is it a problem if men are not the big honchos in all marriages?
Only if the husband is loving, caring, etc. I’m a young guy, but did everything for my ex (~4 year relationship) and she broke up with me because I didn’t play the masculine role, dominate, etc. She was a damn superior woman, super smart, and believe she can be independent and do everything on her own, and her family was rich. I’m super smart, great guy, athletic, and really caring, but I have to get her to “obey” me in order for the relationship to truly last. She’s now on the search for someone that could be masculine, be a leader, and someone she looks up to, etc.
So, what you are saying makes a lot of sense. Women should submit and obey their husbands. The husbands will love you no matter what if he’s in the relationship. If he’s a good guy, he’ll always think you’re attractive. For females, they are attracted to a guy’s behavior, and if he changes, then her feelings toward you will change. Guys have to sort of be an alpha male. I know it sucks, it sucks for all the nice guys out there… That’s why there’s so little of us left, because we all get walked on.
idk, I’m only 20, so I’ve got a lot more to learn. =D but that was the jist of what I extracted from my being with my ex.
Dan the day women do this is when the world will end.
There are many assertions in this post that are Biblically wrong. I understand that you are “trolling,” but you are looking for different views and answers, right? ;)
While the Bible does say for women to respect their husbands, and for husbands to love their wives, there is no connection between love and respect and working outside of the home. Deborah was a prophetess and judge in Israel. Lydia was a seller of purple in the New Testament.
Once again, it’s not a legalistic set of rules of “should’s” and “should nots” but a matter of the heart. How does a wife act and speak in such ways that she shows respect for her husband? How does a husband act and speak in such ways that he shows love to his wife?
I would recommend a book called “Love and Respect” by Dr. Emerson Eggerichs. While the book can be somewhat redundant at times, the author successfully makes a few points about the differences between men and women. Women tend to be better at expressing love than men. It’s not that men don’t love, but they are not as open relationally as women (Contrast sports talk with galfriend talk). However, while women can express love, at times it is hard to express respect while expressing that love (hence the stereotype of the nagging wife…does she love him? Yes, but he may also feel put down because she doesn’t express it in a respectful way.) Hence, Paul and Peter are telling each gender to work on their weaknesses. When men feel respected, they tend to be more expressive of their love, and when women feel loved, they tend to express more respect. It’s not a matter of putting one gender down, but of both having their needs met.
I used to be opposed to the idea of submission and respect until God taught me a lesson a few weeks ago. I am a pretty independent woman, working on a law degree, and I’m blessed to have the opportunity to work at a pretty big firm. God led me to my significant other a few months ago. He is a partner at a law firm and loves Christ with heart, soul, mind, and strength. Talk about two independent people butting heads, right? Ok, God, so how does this submission-thing work…
My BF has never suggested that I quit law, in fact he encourages me to stay in it because God has gifted me with talent in this area. The submission comes in how I react to his decisions for both of us, even if I am a little ambivalent about the timing or his views on the matter. He genuinely wants my input because he loves me, and oftentimes we’ll find a solution that incorporates both of our views. However, in the few times that we’ve come to a significant disagreement, there is a pattern. If he is making a decision for selfish reasons, the conflict allows God to search his heart to ensure that he’s acting out of love. However, for the times that he is making decisions out of love and I choose not to submit, there is pain because my lack of submission is usually based out of desiring to protect myself or do things my own way. Self-centeredness is NOT a healthy dynamic for a relationship. I find that I have a lot more joy and love if I trust God to protect me even if my BF is not 100% right about things (see Abraham and Sarah), and my BF cherishes me because he knows that he has my trust. To get the love, joy, and peace in exchange for submission, even if the submission gets hairy at times, is definitely worth it.
Ugh I hate it when people say, “well, they can still be equal, and the husband should still love his wife, but he’s still the head of the family.” No, that’s an oxymoron. Saying that a woman should ignore her own judgement and go with what the husband says is implying that the husband knows best and has better judgement. It’s bullshit. I’d rather stay single for the rest of my life than be with a man who honestly believed that.
And for the record, I want to be dependent on a man, but emotionally dependent. I want my husband to see me as a person with unique strengths and weaknesses. If I’m better at paying the bills, I want him to let me pay the bills. If I’m bad at cooking, I want him to help me cook. I don’t want him to see me as having the same strengths and weaknesses as half of the population just because I happen to have a vagina. That’s shallow and dumb, and there’s a reason society quit buying into that shit.
The world would be a better place if people like this didn’t exist. Most of us are forward thinkers in the world – kicking and screaming, will you be dragged into the 21st century. This mindset is no different than pretty much every Arab country in the world, and a few others to boot.
Guess who you’re rubbing shoulders with, believing this kind of nonsense? The same kind of people that stone people to death, and cut off hands.
Nice company bucko, you better move eastward.
If the husband is being the person he’s suppose to then submitting will be easy. Husbands need to be servants. Husbands need to wash feet, take care of their wives. If I want something good to grow in my house I need to plant and tenderly take care of the growth. Submission can’t be demanded it must come from love.
“I used to be opposed to the idea of
submission and respect until God taught me a lesson a few weeks ago. I
am a pretty independent woman, working on a law degree, and I’m blessed
to have the opportunity to work at a pretty big firm. God led me to my
significant other a few months ago. He is a partner at a law firm and
loves Christ with heart, soul, mind, and strength. “
I was with you until I found you’re a lawyer. The lot of ya can go to hell, you greedy poor-excuse for a human being. How many people have you screwed today? How many families have you ripped apart in the interest of your law firm, money, and power? Or do you just hide behind your silver walls?
Blessed to work a big law firm. Wow, your priorities are screwed, lady.
I think that this requires all kinds of assumptions that are not correct. Men are not really required to support their families independently, as they once were. Men are not always capable of this, either. Our money is worth less than it used to be, and things are more expensive. Not women’s fault, just the state of the economy right now. Many women are capable and willing to work outside of the home and bring home bacon of their own. Also, what about women without children? Should they sit around in their clean houses with their folded laundry planning dinner all day long? And, just so you know, women still make significantly less money than men. For the same job, they make $0.75 for ever $1 made by a man.
Is this a joke? I’m not even going to get started. If you’re really this messed up in the head you don’t even deserve to hear our opinions. Not that they would make a difference to you.
@VeritatisAmans - why is it automatically assumed that the man is better fit to be the “leader” in a marriage? you are then automatically pin pointing the characteristics of an optimal leader on the man, when the woman could very well be better equipped to lead. also, i think a lot of the male and female’s “place” in a marriage is based solely on stereotypical gender roles. what about women who go against their assumed gender roles – strong, independent, determined leaders…are they not fit for marriage? obviously it takes TWO to make a marriage work…but in my system of beliefs there is no “leader”, but rather two EQUAL partners. assigning leadership to one person automatically puts one above the other.
Actually, it’s working out quite well for us, and I fail to see how this has any relevance for those of us who don’t want/have children.
This assumption:
“Now so many working women wish they could be back in the home.”
needs to be proven before what follows can be taken seriously.
EGAD! archaic and idiotic
i always submit to my man, when he’s within reason. i think thats a fair trade, i’ll listen to you if you arent stupid.
but, then again, im a follower. i dont like being alone, and he takes care of me. im independent when i want to be, and he’s okay with that, but…i do like answering to him. im happy he’s the one in charge…and i doubt he has many issues with it either. (unless im being a little too indecisive. which so happens.)
edit: i also wish i didnt have a job, and i would love to be a stay at home mom when the time comes. thanks for ruining all my fun feminists. call me old fashioned but shit, the guy has a point you know. lol.
obvious troll is obvious.
Ha! Dan! You only read the part you liked! Typical male! Read on just a little bit more:
25
Husbands, love your
wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her
26
Ha! Think a little bit about how Christ gave himself up to the Church… He gave ALL his worldly possessions – even his life – to the welfare of the Church…
Dan – when you are ready to give all you have to your wife, and climb up on a cross to get the nails, maybe then you can expect a woman to submit. And by the way, why should the woman go first in the this? I assume you would expect the man to be the spiritual leader, right? Lead on Dude! Give all you have to your wife and start climbing up on the cross! Or are you going to let your wife lead the way?
Bluck! Bluck! Bluck!
Dude! Are you ready?
Ha!
Yawwwwwwn.
Next.
I dont want a submissive wife.. Boring as hell.. All women should be who they want to be.. and if the husband dont like it, tell him to get something else.
Women working drive wages down. Women have always worked.
@ackthpt - You’re wrong. Islam treats women as inferior. Christianity does nothing of the sort. If you’ll read on it says that husbands are to love their wives as Christ loved the church and gave Himself for her. Christ was very humble and very loving. If men could love their wives a fraction of how Christ loved the church, women would have no issues at all with submitting.
submit? does that mean i don’t have to work anymore and just do womanly duties?
actually really well thanks! thanks to feminists i won’t be confined to being solely a mother and i can actually give back to society…and myself! I know SCARY thought women revolving their lives around things like that instead of their husband.
The two-income family didn’t come from feminism, it originated with the industrial revolution. After that happened, most working women were working out of financial necessity. The only thing mainstream feminism did was try to balance the playing field so that:
1. Working women weren’t demonized / stigmatized.
2. They would be paid an equal wage for equal work.
You have some extremist branches of feminism that encourage all sorts of things that aren’t inline with mainstream feminism, just like Christians have their own extremist branches that handle snakes and bomb abortion clinics.
In regards to Ephesians (and many other NT verses regarding women’s roles), you have to remember that women were uneducated and were considered pieces of property back then, a step above slaves (which the Bible also does NOT endorse simply because it talks about how the slave should obey his master). This is why Paul talks in Corinthians about how women should be silent in the church and ask their husbands for teaching – the husband was the educated one who could properly pass on the teachings and answer questions at home. Does that mean women shouldn’t talk in church today?
Cultural context plays a big role in understanding the Bible and the evolution of its meaning over time (why there are strict verses in the Old Testament as opposed to the broad freedom in the New Testament). Trying to force a simple verse onto a different society is like forcing a square block into a circular hole. We need to be able to recognize the intention of the lessons and learn how to apply them to today’s society.
Yes I agree but husbands should also submit to their wives. 50/50 I say!
“so many women working outside the home has driven down the wages of men”
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1983185,00.html
lol.
this is a double-edged sword. I agree, but only to an extent. If by “submit” you mean, cook, clean, care for children and be available for sex, then no. That is not submitting, that is slavery. “Submit” can be equated to “love”, “respect” AND “obediance” along with many other things. However this should only be the case if said husband is the same way (SUBMITTED) to the LORD. If he submits his heart to the LORD, the wife should do the same to her husband as she does to the LORD herself. In the husband’s submittance, the LORD guides him to take proper care of the wife and shows the wife how to gracefully be lead (if need be) and cared for. This does not mean that she should blindly follow what her husband says and hope that it is what the LORD wishes of her. If she is following the LORD, He does not need her to have a husband to guide her. The LORD can guide her on His own, regardless of whether or not she is married. (Otherwise, women who are destined to be single just dont have any saving grace or hope for life.)
Submitting to someone (whether parent or spouse) is a mixture of many things, not just respect/obediance/. Regardless of what your personal definition of “submit” is, LOVE has to be in the mix MUTUALLY.
@Hinase - I can understand and connect with your view Hinase-I myself am a christian,but I have different ways of thinking than my parents. True,I used to rebel against my parents and I still do from time to time..but,I don’t go pulling out verses outta the bible,I respect everyone’s beliefs and I myself think that women working is a fine idea,true some wish to go back to home life,but there are cases where the wife enjoys working and it’s better for the entire family. It is sad that they aren’t able to raise their children as they want to,but it takes a village to raise a child*old saying I know*that child/those children will be influenced by family,family friends,anyone that is an adult. In a way,you won’t be raising your child but also the people closest to you. I think that us Christians TheThelogiansCafe,should not be so judgmental about today’s society,we should only focus on OUR lives and what goes on in them. Not focus on others problems,issues,burdens,ect. Times have changed,but there are some women that DO submit to their Husbands,but there is such a thing as ‘bending backwards too much’-there are LIMITS to submission. That is my OPINION and I can express it freely
Alina
@Codelyokogurl1994 - I completely agree with you there.
However, 1 Corinthians 11 also says that women should wear head coverings, that men having long hair is disgraceful. we always pick and choose and read through distorted contexts. We have to be able to read the Bible into new contexts, applicable to this day in age, against the oppression of others.
@Hinase - Thank you,I honestly do not like Christians that think that WE are all so high and mighty-GOD is the one that is high and mighty. We are only humans,and as humans we should try and get along with society instead of doing all we can by doing and saying such outrages things.
However, the availability of replica watches online at a point of sale is a proposal a little extravagant. Breitling replica watches are sold for thousands of companies on the Internet or sold on the streets. Most of these companies offer security and support anywhere from 30 days to 1 year.
The only husbands who expect their wives to “submit”, are those that are power hungry and deserve to be whipped by a 300-pound dominatrix. On a regular basis. With no happy ending.
@Codelyokogurl1994 - I think so too. That’s why I feel offended by some people calling themselves christians and acting all high and mighty or pulling out bible verses to fit their own needs. It’s not meant to be taken out of context. I can see why people have problems with us, because of that group that does it. It’s hard for you and I, as christians to beat back that stereotype when others are reinforcing it all the time.
haha — everyone took this as a joke. But it actually isn’t. The change in family structure that has occured in the last half century has had profound effects on children, marriage, and “life satisfaction.” That we cannot go back in time is unquestionable. That the current state is ideal is very questionable. PS everytime I read crap from “christians” I’m estatic that I am Catholic and don’t pay attention to the stupidity of the books that make no difference, and have been superceeded by the gospels of the apostles (as allegory and metaphor, btw).
@Hinase - So true,I don’t like abortion,but that doesn’t mean I’m going to and bomb the place!*off-topic I know*If people don’t want to have a baby then use a condom or better yet-DON’T DO IT! Those type of Christians are giving ALL CHRISTIANS a bad rep and name. If you want to make a difference as a Christian,then respectfully do something about it..I doubt god would want ANY Christian to bomb a place,killing even MORE people. And I doubt that god would want woman to submit to the point where the Husband would beat and beat her til the cows come home.
I feel that women should have the choice to “submit” or not to submit, without fear of retribution from their religion. Also, their religion shouldn’t push patriarchy in the first place, which can fuel the feminism fire and allow certain women to abandon their faith which they believe to be outdated and demeaning.
Did Jesus say that? Oh, no, it was Paul who said that. Oh, wait, maybe not even Paul, maybe some guy who studied (once shared a urinal, who knows) under/with/about Paul. I’ve been a SAHM and I’ve been a working mom and I’m not sure what either of that has to do with some possible-misogynist declaring rules for women. Also, interesting his rules on slave/master. Oh, yeah… I’m not worried about what Paul/Pseudo-Paul says about how women should submit to pretty much anything. But it was fun to read your post.
Disagree,
YES Bible did say that wives must submit to their husbands >> only if the husband first submit to the will of the Lord— love the wife like Jesus love the Church. If the husband is NOT in the will of God, treating the wife like crap, then I think that in this case the wife doesn’t have to submit to their husband. By the way, if you’re taking this Bible verse this literally, what about “SUBMIT ONTO ONE ANOTHER”?
And the Bible says NOTHING about not allowing married women to work. Money might be the start of some arguments between married couples, but it has NOTHING to do with whether the wife is submitting to their husband or not. Having two income is mostly because of household needs, and in today’s society and economy, families will struggle even more if every married women returns to their home. If a husband truly loves his wife, and the wife truly loves the husband, they will be able to communicate and discuss how they’ll be managing the money, and they’ll do their best to understand each others opinions and each make some compromises to come up with an agreement.
My own parents are both working, and they’ve been happily married for 25 years. As for myself, I am the wife you asked for — I’m a stay-at-home mom relying on my husband to provide, yet my marriage is AWFUL because not only my husband don’t make enough to support us, he waste the money that he makes on stupid things for himself, and does not allow me to have any say in our spending.
Your blog is only partially correct — todays women will be so much happier if they submit to their husband WHOM IS ALSO SUBMITTING TO THE WILL OF THE LORD.
But Dan….women are liberated…and with that liberation comes the enslavement of the rest of us. Women working along side men have generated so many rules that practically nothing gets done anymore. And the bad part of this is that you still can’t tell a woman what to do, (even with sugar on top) without her getting her panties in a twist. But it’s okay, because when she wants something, the panties usually come off anyways. LOL
@Hinase - i was going to say the EXACT same thing. some trolls…haha.
wow, coming from someone who could not be more repulsed by the idea of being a SAHM or submissive to anyone especially a man- this blog has to be the biggest frackin joke ever. You wrote it in order to trigger a response…well you got mine.
I can’t believe you wrote that its soooo incredibly f**ked up. Oh and if you are wondering I AM NOT A LESBIAN EITHER, just another unsubmissive woman not having kids or bowing down to a man such as yourself.
@dude_this_world_sux - Really? Lol. Yup, some trolls.
Oh wow..
I have nothing nice to say so it’s probably best that I keep my mouth shut.
@explosive - Damn right he can say whatever he wants. It’s called freedom of speech. No one ever said you had to like it. And I fail to see how I’m a hypocrite, considering I don’t buy into all this religious bullshit to begin with.
@TheGhioniFiles - LOL!!!
you are such a douche
My mom was submissive to my dad… and he made her get a job, leaving her little children at home.
I don’t plan on having my own children (i.e. “little” children) because I want to foster teenagers, but I will likely also have a job. Yes, my (future) husband could ask me to submit to him by not getting a job and popping out babies, but any man who asked me to abandon my God-inspired desires to help foster teenagers doesn’t really love me anyway.
i always find it interesting that in vs. 21 of Gal.5 it says we’re to submit to ONE ANOTHER.. then it goes on to list the individual specifics. ie. men loving wives. wives, reverencing. makes me wonder if the ground work to those two things actually working in a marriage, love/ respect, is dependent upon us first needing to submit to the other~ yield our own expectations, etc.
Both should submit to each other, it should be equal. Or it could depend on the situation.
Yes, you are right….Women should submit. Just as soon as I find a real man that can lead by Christ example and love me more than he loves himself….
@In_Reason_I_Trust -
Sorry, but.. Huh?
lol Dan… I kind of agree. Fuck independence. Pfft.
I blame politicians for irritating this subresult of feminism.
Dan, Dan, Dan. How could you ever think of leaving Xanga! Who would stir the pot like this if you left? It wouldn’t be the same.
Troll la la ….
Now you’re just being an asshole for controversy and attention.
enlightening.
lol no…….
i mean, it would be nice, but selfish.
In modern society where both parents are working, I think it’s hard for any one person to be the head of anything.
As a Christian, a man should be the figure, model of Christ-like actions, but there should be the wife who should gain equal respect for the amount of arduous work she does as well.
I’m Christian, but this is about the only time I envy Atheists. Because Atheist women don’t have to worry about listening to crap like this. Does anyone even realize that the Bible was written by MEN who drank wine on a daily basis? I don’t care how hard people try to sugar coat what “submit” means. It is clearly defined as: to yield to the CONTROL of another. Whoever claimed that all men are smarter and wiser than all women is an idiot. I know plenty of women who are smarter& wiser than their husbands & if they were to give control to their men, they’d end up on the streets.
WRONG QUESTION. The question shouldn’t be “Should women follow this one verse of the Bible?” but rather should women (and men) follow anything from the Bible that doesn’t make sense in today’s world? What about all the other passages in the Bible that don’t make sense? Like stoning disobedient children? No one should follow anything in the Bible just because it’s in the Bible. They should follow it because it resonates to what is truth within themselves. If it makes sense that women should respect their husbands, then follow it. If it doesn’t make sense that women should obey their husband (and lose their own selves in the process) then they shouldn’t. But they shouldn’t follow some person’s (i.e. minister’s) interpretation.
@poosywhistle - I agree completely!!
@TakingxOverxMe - lol
@yellowflight1 - exactly. Well said.
pft.
It be a better world if woman can just beat and chain up their men and use them as sex slaves or baby makers when needed.
Submitting to my husband = “let’s just tie the (brand new sectional) couch to the top of the car… it’ll be fine…”
I’m a woman and have two kids. I haven’t had a job in a few months now. I swear if I don’t get a job soon, I’m going to kill my whole family. That’s how much I fucking hate raising children. I love them, I just don’t wanna be around them all the time. Working at a job is seriously a break. A nice break too, I get money for it lol.
Those are some intense opinions you’ve got about women there, or were you just stating facts again? Except these aren’t exactly facts, now are they?
@hades_kitty - What if the man likes kids more than the woman? My husband likes kids more than me. They drive me fucking crazy yet I still have to take care of them because the asshole God made me a woman…
@caffeinated_mama - fair dues…but priorities change, it’s good he priorities the kids, as long as he keeps appreciating you, otherwise take a holiday or somesort of plot to leave the household for a week or two and see how they all cope and well they should all be releived when you come back and appreciate what you do for them….
Balance! That is the key.
The epistles to churches, such as Ephesians and Colossians, were meant to be read in their entirety to the whole congregation during the weekly meeting. So Paul first addressed the wives about their role. Hearing this, the men’s ears perked up. Now that the Apostle has their attention, he levels his load on them: their love for their wives is to be selfless and sacrificial. In addition, they are to spiritually nurture their wives. Paul uses more ink addressing the men than he does the wives, making it obvious that the greater burden falls on them.
In a related passage, Peter writes that men are to be understanding of their wives, treating them like delicate works of art, such as fine porcelein china or an exquisite glass sculpture.
Being a man, this speaks to me. The question is, “Am I worthy of my wife’s respect and submission?”
I think women should respect their husbands, and husbands respect their wives.
If we’re gonna start following the bible word for word…
Don’t wear clothes made of more than
one fabric (Leviticus 19:19) Don’t cut your hair nor shave. (Leviticus
19:27) Any person who curseth his mother or
father, must be killed. (Leviticus 20:9) People who have flat noses, or are
blind or lame, cannot go to an altar of God (Leviticus 21:17-18) If anyone, even your own family
suggests worshipping another God, kill them. (Deuteronomy 13:6-10) If you find out a city worships a
different god, destroy the city and kill all of it’s inhabitants… even
the animals. (Deuteronomy 13:12-15) Kill anyone with a different
religion. (Deuteronomy 17:2-7) Don’t touch your menstrual gf/wife! (Leviticus
15:19-20)
Get back to me when you’re done with burning all your clothes, turning into a mountain man, killing a crapton of people, and probably getting divorced. Because trust me, you’re STILL not doing it right.
Yeah. Shit just got real.
Well let me start off by saying that I am Agnostic and I have absolutely no affiliation with Christianity or the Bible.
There are many situations in which a woman submitting to her husband would be a bad idea. Mainly because many people get married quickly and without contemplation of the phrase “until death do us part”.
I believe in a perfect situation, when your husband loves you, is affectionate, and has the best in mind for his family a wife should happily submit to her husband. This does not mean that she has to be submissive to all men or should feel as though men are superior, because they are not. However your husband should be the exception. He should be your better half but also your equal partner. This is easier when you have made a wise choice for a spouse.
@xFgtxRainbowx - Haha well put!
If their were any real men left in the world, then I could see your point.
@MartinTreehouse - Y&ou are Right!!! Even though the Spouse is Christian, She might Leave 4No Reason… My Ex eses; Left me for other MeN…
Wives submissive??? ha ha ha, i doubt to FIND a truly, reaLLy, LoveLy, Lady to Commit !!!