March 18, 2013
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One Year Sentence for Rape
Two high school boys were convicted of rape and sentenced to one year in juvenile jail. (They could still serve until they are 21).
They had sex with a 16-year-old girl who was drunk.They were underage too. The girl was so drunk that she did not remember it but they took photos. Here is the link: LinkI was kind of surprised they were only sentenced for a year.Is one year in jail an appropriate sentence for rape?
Comments (186)
All that outrage and they only get a year… wow
I read that they actually have to serve in juvenile detention until they reach 21. But, I still think that’s too light of a sentence. Then again, I’m a believer of cruel and unusual punishment.
one year? just one year?
Fuck America.
They’re football players. I’m not surprised.
No. It’s not right.
@laytexduckie - they should have their fingers cut off.
The article says “at least one year” and possibly until they turn 21. The one who sent the photos will also have to serve another sentence once this one ends. One year is not enough for rape; however, I believe the focus with juveniles should be on counseling and rehabilitation so they can safely reenter society. If they can do that in a year, I’m fine with that. I would think it would take longer, though.
unfortunately that is pretty much a normal sentence and I am not surprised.
yeah, that’s fair. Rape isn’t really the worst crime.
To be fair, they also have to register as sex offenders, which last longer than a year. Still, it seems like they should’ve gotten more time.
That is unfortunate, for all involved. Hopefully one year is enough time for these boys to come to terms with their behavior and be taught a better way.
It would be helpful to know what exact statute they were found guilty under, what the facts of the case were, and what the reasoning of the judge was, if any was given, for the exact sentence given. Without that information, it’s hard to really judge the fairness of the sentence.
(Also, being eligible for either parole or early release within one year isn’t exactly being given a one-year sentence.)
@Erika_Steele -
The United States has some of the harshest and longest sentences for criminal offenses. Just because the news shines a spotlight on the potentially shockingly short sentences, doesn’t mean that’s the norm.
I didn’t know the sentence came down until I saw your blog.
@whataboutbahb - Here’s a good and long article about this case, from the Akron Beacon Journal: click here
I had hoped they would be thrown into regular prison where there would be no photos taken of all the rape they would experience firsthand.
@Marica0701 - Thanks, that article was very informative.
Are these the kids who weren’t even going to be charged in the first place? At least it’s a step forward that it went to trial. Also, like @whataboutbahb said, it would be nice to know those other details as well.
Dan: After reading the Akron Beacon Journal article, you might want to consider changing your original post–while “sex” can be a broad term, it can be misleading when the act in question was digital penetration.
I cannot believe that being able to throw a fuckin ball means you get off easy when committing a deliberate crime. As if the evidence for what they did isn’t plastered all over the internet; as if they didn’t take something from this girl that she can never get back. Gotdam America, the rape culture here fricken stinks for miles.
no. im sorry but rape is far past any other assault. They should have gotten a lot longer.
for minors? I think that lots of community service and counseling might be a better plan than simple prison time.
Then again, if it was my daughter, they might be dead.
@Colorsofthenight - I’ve got an idea, why don’t you go volunteer to spend a couple years in a penetentury and see how or if, your opinion changes after the first time you are gang raped ? or maybe someone should just get you drunk enough that you have no self control, and then multiple rape you…. after all, it’s not that bad of a crime ….. right?
The judge was applying the, “Boys will be boys,” postulate.
@whataboutbahb - so you’d have rather them penetrated her with a penis than their fingers? rape is still rape, regardless of what object is used.
@Love_in_102 - I’d rather people didn’t rape people. I also prefer having as much information as possible and that information being precise. Facts matter, otherwise all offenses would simply have a set punishment, without having a sentencing phase in a criminal trial. Dan likes to play around with facts to maximize emotional responses to his posts. I was just suggesting he be more precise.
@whataboutbahb - I understand what you’re saying. misleading titles are nothing new, though. news channels do it, and every day people do it. sad thing is we never get to know all of the real details.
@acomfortingcolloquy - You know…I agree with you. I wasn’t even going to comment on here because no one would appreciate what I would say, but you compelled me. Locking a kid up in prison for years doesn’t solve any problems – it only makes them worse, and then you end up with a non-functioning member of society. I like your way better.
@Love_in_102 - Agreed. Free markets can be great in many ways, but I’m not a fan of how they promote sensationalism in the news. Also, I may have given you the wrong impression in the post you originally responded to: I wasn’t suggesting Dan change his title–most state rape statutes include digital penetration as one of the ways the statute can be violated. I was suggested that his following sentence might be misleading: “They had sex with a 16-year-old girl who was drunk.” I’m not trying to justify or discount their behavior, but for some people rape that involves penile penetration may be viewed as even more serious than digital penetration. If Dan is hoping for as accurate as possible feedback on this particular case, it would be helpful if he provided as accurate as possible information. (That said, he isn’t, so my suggestion was probably pointless.)
Life in prison and sterilize them.
Just so we’re clear… in America.. Cocaine possession = 3-5 years in prison (if you’re Lohan… nothing)Crack possession = 15 years in prisonPirating music = Up to 5 years in prisonWhat these little shits got… = 1 year…
I’ve written how I feel about the whole thing on my blog. I don’t feel any sympathy when all parties committed crimes, even the girl. She was underage drinking and should be ticketed and fined as well. There are situations where I would defend the victim when they are raped, but not when everyone is being reckless and underage. I know they should have enough common sense to be more careful about what they do when underage drinking. No sympathies for anyone involved. This is an unpopular opinion.
@xinq - I definitely agree with you. I don’t believe she should be to blame for what the boys did, but she did put herself in a very horrible situation. why didn’t anybody get in trouble for underage drinking? why didn’t anybody get in trouble for supplying alcohol to minors?
@Love_in_102 - I hope they do another article but from the people who were in charge of the party. They’re all talking about the boys and the girl but I want to hear more about the person/people who were in charge of the party and how they could let it get this out of control. Me and my roommates have thrown massive parties and it has never gotten out of hand and we made sure of it.
@xinq - well, these were high schoolers. it could’ve just been just a bunch of underage teens who raided their parents liquor cabinets while they were out of town, or paid someone on the street to buy it for them, y’know? but of course, none of that mess will EVER be investigated.
No.
No, rape should be treated like the violent crime it is. Years upon years.
how much rape was there? The girl was legally able, willingly drunk (probably illegally) and suffered no damage
what about being charged for distributing child porn since they took pics
In china they would have been killed- it’s one reason I like living in China
@Love_in_102 - Along with their dicks.
@briandermot - there is no probably about it. they were all drinking underage, and she was drunk. you can not give consent while intoxicated. bottom line.
@tgwiy - yeah, makes sense, right?
@whataboutbahb - I definitely agree with what you’re saying, but Dan likes to go more for the shock factor. that’s why it’s always good to read his links before you read his post.
I think there was a reason they got what they got. They could have shown extreme remorse. The girl was drunk, the guys were drunk, too. The problem with having drunken sex is that if you try to argue that you didn’t know what you were doing, the defense will argue the same thing. The judge probably felt from watching the trial that the boys had a shot at rehabilitation and went easy on them. Rapists deserve to get put away for a long time… She could have seen some good in these boys and thought they could use a chance at rehabilitation. I don’t know.
The news tries to play with our emotions. They want us to be outraged, so they go for shock factor. Unfortunately, they refuse to report the whole story and because of that, I can’t decide what these boys deserved. I wasn’t in that courtroom, I can’t make an informed opinion.
Also, I believe they were tried for a juvenile and not as an adult, that in itself will lessen the charges.
They say others will be charged for “not reporting it while they watched/knew about the attack”. I’m still waiting for adults to be held responsible for supplying alcohol to the underage kids….
Digital penetration? We’re still analogue over here in UK
@xinq - You have no sympathy for a rape victim because she was “being” underage? How reckless of her not to be older! If she was drinking you think she is fair game for rape? I wonder why you think that would be an unpopular opinion!
I am against rape in any form. It’s a crime and should be punished as a serious crime.
I think the people who took and posted photos should be charged.
This is not an open and shut rape case.
This is a bunch of teens making the idiotic choice to get wasted ignoring the real consequences, both legal, social and emotional of doing so.
There is this thing called reality. And the reality is that when people get wasted, CHOOSE to get wasted, they have chosen to give up their own ability to make real choices for themselves. Getting wasted around a bunch of other people who are wasted, including lots of strangers who are wasted…is even more idiotic.
We can try to ignore reality, and that these people all made THAT choice, and pretend this is just another case of football players getting special treatment no matter what, or we can, as it looks the judge has done…taken reality into account.
I would urge people to read more detailed information on this case.
@EmilyandAtticus - I have no sympathy for rape victims who were also committing crimes. Like I said they knew drinking alcohol was at least illegal they should have been more careful, all of them. I’m not gonna jump on a band wagon and pity someone when she wasn’t doing something productive. Teens try so hard to be hip and this is what happens. Like I said, if she wasn’t committing any crimes along with them, I’d feel sorry for her, but the law should show no sympathy to anyone who is breaking the law, that’s if the law works right. It’s like if a mother had a daughter who was raped, the law didn’t do justice so she took it into her own hands and killed the guys that raped her daughter instead. She committed a crime, and went to jail. I don’t pity people who also commit crimes.
Like I said I view things from all sides and no one looks good in this case.
It’s called being a responsible teen, not acting older. Whatever, though. If it was my kid I wouldn’t have allowed her to go to this activity in the first place. She probably lied where she was going and she isn’t as innocent as people make her out to be.
People always say when it’s your daughter what are you going to think? What if it was your sons who did this? Then you would have a different opinion. Again, I have sympathy for NO ONE.
They should all suffer consequences for their reckless actions.
@Love_in_102 - That could have been most likely it. Yeah, I agree, I have no clue.
@ccccourage - I’m not saying the boys shouldn’t be punished, they should ALL be punished for whatever crimes they committed. If I was to get caught drinking underage, I’d get ticketed and fined. I don’t know why the articles aren’t saying anything about that. Exactly, they were ALL idiotic.
timewise, it doesn’t sound like it – but 72+ hours in a juvenile detention facility is enough to melt most high school (even adult) bullies.
tack on them having to register as sex-offenders and it’s pretty much assured their lives are ruined.
one year for rape in america, 5 years for downloading a movie. I hate this place.
NOT ENOUGH!!!
@xinq -
You’ve just lost your right to consume air.
Underage drinking is bad, sure, BUT THAT DOESN’T JUSTIFY RAPE YOU WORTHLESS, DISGUSTING EXCUSE FOR A HUMAN.
@DougX831 - Lol Like I care what an idiot like you thinks. It’s called I have my own mind and can think whatever the hell I fuckin’ want. People always say what if it was your daughter, what if it was your sons? You always see things so black and white. Newsflash, the world isn’t black and white.
@DougX831 - What they did was assaulted her. I heard they didn’t even actually rape her. As a true rape victim they should get punishment, but not as much as what people think since they didn’t actually rape her. I hope when they’re in the slammer that’ll cause them to grow up. Hunny it’s called I have an open mind and I see things from all perspectives.
men are such animals!
where was that girl’s girlfriends?
http://jamplify.com/94jD0K
1 Year in jail? shame. this is what I think HERE
In our individual life, it only take one moment in time to change everything for the positive or negative. I just hope that these young people learn from this truth they experiece.
@xinq -
Open mind: easier for your brain to fall out.
There is no ambiguity here, you fucking moron. Without her consent, ANY sexual activity is a violation, no matter what she was doing.
“as an actual rape victim…” Bitch, you’re lucky this isn’t a face to face conversation because I would not hesitate to slap the fuck out of you for this, you arrogant and vile little cunt.
You call me an idiot while you blatantly justify rape? I’ll own that, happily.
(assuming, of course, that I had somewhere to wash my hands afterwards)
@DougX831 - You have been harassing me for a long time on datingish and xanga. I couldn’t care less how you view me. Fuck off.
Heh, thats funny. I generally avoid your dumb ass @xinq - like the plague.
@DougX831 - Lol cause you totally “avoided” me here, whatever, though. Like I said, I don’t care what a moron like you thinks. Takes one to know one.
@xinq -
http://www.dictionary.com
Type “generally” in the search box.
@DougX831 - I made a blog dedicated to you on my page.
@xinq -
Congratulations. You, however, weren’t worth my time to return the favor.
@DougX831 - http://xinq.xanga.com/772170617/dougx831/
@xinq -
Thanks for the link, but… You dont actually expect me to give enough of a fuck to come read it, do you?
@DougX831 - I dare you to have an opinion on something that isn’t a popular opinion. Oh wait, no you’re one of those that always jumps on a bandwagon. Like the xinq hate bandwagon ya jump on that, you always jump on a popular opinion because you don’t have the balls to think different.
@Lost__In_My_Mind - I was with you in thinking the same thing about not having the full story, but then the photos came into play. If they were sharing the photos with friends and that’s how this all came to light, it just goes to show their intent and actual level of remorse. Also, I’m not not sure what the laws say about it in Ohio, but here in California, that would be considered distribution and production of child porn.
The judge did give them a year sentence with the potential of jail time until they’re 21 and probably because they’re minors, which might be the way to go because it doesn’t sound like anyone knows what the full story is. I think though that it should’ve been a harsher sentence for the photos alone. I know that if I did something wrong and had taken photos of it, if I felt guilty about it later, I wouldn’t have kept a nice little momento of it.
@xinq - No sympathy…? None? Really? So the penalty of doing some illegal is to be raped? Gotcha. If I’m ever in the back of a cop car I’ll think “wow…I deserve to be raped. I deserve to have someone stronger than me physically violate me. I deserve to not be able to trust any of my partners in years to come. I deserve to be dry when it happens so my insides will tear.” that’s EXACTLY what I’ll be thinking. Do you know what you’re doing? Victim blaming.
God forbid it ever happens to you.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA*breathes*HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
@HexagonQuirks - Yeah I read that and was like “Oh heaven forbid I jay walk and get raped or run over or murdered because I totally would have been asking for it.” I’m sure she also thinks that girls who wear short skirts or goes braless is begging to get raped.
@voodoo_flower_child -
Corporate America>individual safety
@Lithium98 – They did get in trouble for distribution of child porn, and I’m glad they did. I agree taking the pictures and distributing them is wrong. However, consider this scenario. They had sex, they were all wasted but she consented. The next day, her picture is everywhere, because young boys can be really stupid (send it to one friend, bragging about getting laid, and he forwards it… The cycle begins). She gets upset and cries rape. This kind of thing happens all too often.
I just think there’s way more to this story than we’re hearing outside of the courtroom. If this girl genuinely was raped, that’s awful and maybe the boys do deserve worse, but I just feel if they really did deserve worse, they would have received it. Judges are rarely lenient on rape cases.
@xinq - good thing she wasn’t also crossing the street too far from the crosswalk, else we’d have to make her pay restitution to her rapists for being guilty of more crimes than they were. Throw the book at that bitch.
@xinq - You know you just said it’s okay to be raped as long as you commit a crime first, right?
@Lithium98 - No I said they should all be punished for whatever crimes they committed. Thanks.
No one wants to hear this but that is a typical sentence for a first time offense by a juvenile. The truth is that the problem is not the light sentence. Its that most of their peers did not think it was so bad. These guys were not ashamed of what they did. they did not even think they needed to hide what they did. They assaulted her in front of everyone, took pictures of the crime and texted them around (I am sure you could still find those pictures at that school). The evidence of the crime was given to anyone who wanted to see it as if it was a harmless thing they did. It looks like they thought that she would enjoy it and would think it was funny. And in the case of most of their friends they were right, most of them saw little wrong in what happened. It was funny to them and well porn is fun. That was all it was to them
The problem is not with the courts
@Lithium98 - by the way i hope you know no one forced her to drink. and i hope you do realize you guys defending her not getting what i’m saying are saying she shouldn’t be punished for underaged drinking just because she got raped.
@xinq - No one is saying she shouldn’t be punished for her underage drinking. Just because she was raped doesn’t mean the rules don’t apply to her as well. I understand you think everyone should be held accountable for their actions but when you say things like “no one forced her to drink”, you give off the impression that you feel her being raped is an acceptable punishment for having alcohol at a young age. This is why everyone is up in arms. Being raped is not an acceptable punishment at all for anything. We have a legal system that is to deal out the appropriate punishment for the crimes committed by any individual. That’s what everyone else is trying to say.
@forever_musing - Oh lord, I’m braless three days out of week…
when are the men going to realize I NEED THEM!?
I can’t help but not feel sorry for someone when she drank to the point
where she was blacked out and who has crappy friends that don’t defend
her. Even as a legal drinker I’ve never blacked out. Does the girl not have some blame?
I think rape is a serious crime. This story was very involved (as she had no recollection of the crime and there was no penetration by penis) and the entire thing was horrible for all the teenagers involved (all under age drinkers/drunks). I am also concerned that camera phones captured two boys carrying the drunk female at the main event of that drunken party and that texting played such a role in getting the situation fired up after the fact.
I really cannot believe the number of people who think it was okay for these boys to rape this girl because she passed out drunk. Are you fucking kidding me?
@xinq - NO. SHE DOESN’T. A couple years ago I got given GHB by a doctor because I had narcolepsy. GHB is a date rape drug, anyone could have taken advantage of me and I would not have been able to defend myself. Me taking that drug did not invite men to rape me. And HER DRINKING did NOT invite men to rape her. She is NOT responsible. You should be allowed to pass out and not fear being raped, despite whether it’s legal OR NOT. RAPE is demoralizing and hurts other people for years and years, I know, I am a rape victim, getting drunk is a social posse you do to pass time. She didn’t invite it and she’s NOT responsible get it through your head.
And them getting drunk doesn’t suddenly take away their total moral compass. They knew what they were doing was stupid and wrong. RAPE IS WRONG. Alcohol did not cause them to rape. THEY caused them to rape. I am glad they paraded these boys around the court room and made headlines to warn every other idiot boy out there that rape is wrong.
@FallenSafely - They were all being reckless. I’m not going to jump on the victim bandwagon. I don’t have sympathy for anyone in this story.
@xinq - I’m not sure how much self respect you have then. I hope it never happens to you. You know at a bar and you loose sight of your drink for a minute and somebody slips you a roofie. Sorry it’s your fault, you should have been more careful. Remember this.
@briandermot - “How much rape” ?!
Any rape is too much rape. Just the tip is too much rape.
Fair is relative
@FallenSafely - And apparently, this isn’t the first time it’s happened with those same group of people either. Don’t know why she’d keep on going back to hang out with them. The first time would have been enough for me to tell them to fuck off.
@FallenSafely - Their entire school thought it was ok. Funny even.
@xinq - So now a girl doesn’t have a right to turn in her rapist because he’s raped her before? Are you kidding me? Can you imagine that “I’m sorry Miss but you didn’t turn him in the first time, so that must have meant you LIKED it”.
@trunthepaige - I’m glad this has made such national headlines. Hopefully it will warn other teenagers that they shouldn’t be so stupid.
One year is all, and the girl who was raped is living a life time of being punished by what they did to her.
@Colorsofthenight – Tell that to rape survivors who have to live with what was done with them the rest of their lives.
Foooooootball ben berry berry gooooot to meh.
@xinq - Eat a dick, bitch. I’ve never seen someone so apathetic and horrible as you.
@Grannys_Place - I have been violated. Unless it physically damaged their bodies, they can get over it.
People in our society are so fragile. Then people like me go through enormous amounts of Hell for their weaknesses. I’ve been assaulted in person. I’ve been raped by psychotronic warfare. They do it over and over again because it doesn’t mean anything to me. I’ll use it against them. I’m crying, I’m crying. It makes me mad because I don’t have power, not the act itself. It makes me want to stab someone. Then they’ll give me a lobotomy because I’m “violent.” Well, maybe they shouldn’t have harassed me a bunch. The lobotomy made me more vicious because I have no emotional process.
If you get raped or hurt, then you’re suddenly “mentally ill” due to all the bad stuff people have done to you. It’s so the abusers can keep going after the same people.
I’m also trapped in the “mentally ill” trap due to these people in order to discredit me. I have an organic brain disease, like diabetes, and I have a TBI. They want to put me in here then say, I’m playing the victim after they’ve destroyed me to keep me down. I’m not playing in society again. I quit.
They are manipulative as Hell. It’s like, I’m going to have to twist your arm backwards and flip you over then cage you. I’ve done it several times.
If they break the body, then they deserve to be sued.
@xinq - rape really isn’t a big deal because the body is only slightly damaged.
If they break an arm or something, then they should have to pay for the time that the person is out of work or suffering. If the victim has to go to therapy, then they should have to pay for the therapy.
Putting them in prison does very little but drain all of us.
@xinq - i remember you – you’re that girl who a couple weeks ago was asking the community about your “christian walk” and asking for advice. now i see how you talk on these comments and you are totally a hypocrite. true colors bleeding out, huh?
@FallenSafely - Sadly I think it will take more. Issues of moral and immoral are not discussed. it only what is legal or illegal. And with the law it only matters if you get caught. “Snitches get stitches” is the saying in high school regarding the law
No, they definitely should’ve gotten more than just a year. Maybe I’m too harsh, but 10 years seems like a good minimum.
@xinq - Ha!. Honey, if you tell someone “you don’t care what they think” it might be a little more believable if you don’t leave them 50 more comments, then dedicate a post to them.
I can’t even focus on this post. I feel like I am being raped by your crazyness! AND, i’m not commiting any crimes so maybe I will earn your sympathy!
@Composing_Life - Who are you again? Oh yeah, I don’t give a shit what you think. If you can’t come back with a decent debate then don’t bother. You people are so immature so you expect me to see your point of view because all you can do is attack someone who thinks differently? Like I said since you can’t READ NOR COMPREHEND, If the situation was different, I would feel more sympathy. It’s just a bunch of drunk reckless teens. Please get over yourself.
While some may argue the ethics, I say an eye for an eye. Give them a chance to get raped in the same manner as her. Their posterior and anterior will argue with them and the stupid decision they made for years to come, far outweighing any prison term, although I would include that additionally.
Perhaps receiving said first sentence in the 2nd sentence location of incarceration by willing hardened prisoner volunteers who think only of the re-education values involved for the miscreant youths. Φ ≡
Karma does work – sometimes it just needs a little kick-start to get it going.
@Colorsofthenight – Now Cotton. I think anyone who has been in the ward has been raped one time or other. Two doctors stopped one rape from occurring to me from a new warden assigned. I wrote about that in my novel.
Anytime you place your safety and freedom in someone else’s hands, expect rough condescending treatment from those in power I have learned.
Can’t beat the comfort of those beds tho.
Φ ≡
@dw817 - expect massive abuse.
According to federal law — federal law has jurisdiction — they may yet now be charged for child abuse
@FallenSafely -
In theory people should also be able to leave their doors unlocked without having to fear someone breaking into their house, or walk down the road counting $100 notes without fear of being robbed, but somehow that’s not quite the case. Yes she made unwise decisions and put herself in a bad position, but that doesn’t reduce the boys’ responsibility by one ounce and nothing she did forced them to rape her. That however doesn’t mean people shouldn’t practice reasonable self preservation and protect themselves. That’s she was a victim isn’t mutually exclusive from her having made bad decisions, but it doesn’t discount by any means the boys’ actions.
As for their sentence, it was quite light to me, even though they can be in juvenile detention till age 21. I understand the judge wanting to encourage them to work on themselves in detention to be better members of society, and therefore giving the possibility of earlier release. I still think it’s all too typical of this liberalized society putting the rights of the criminal ahead of justice for the victim. Being juveniles and having no criminal record probably influenced the decision also.
It’s such a well-publicized trial…Surely, it would give pause to other young men who take advantage of a drunk 16 y/o. She took seriously what they poked in fun. BUT, it wasn’t funny. and never should have happened in the first place.
I’m gonna post a comment I found on other websites for bashing CNN:
“Yes the victim is obviously the more important issue here. However, by
focusing on how terrible the rapists lives will be from now on CNN could
be discouraging future rapists because they now they see the
consequences”
I am with Sean Hannity on this one. Had she not dressed so provocatively and not drank alchohol these boys wouldn’t have been tempted. She was a disgrace to her family. What are boys to do?
I just found a hate blog about me in the top blogs and the person didn’t even have the guts to tag me. I have been targetted for a while now I guess people on xanga need to hate someone. It was Jen, now it’s me, who will be the next hate target?. They claim my opinions “don’t” matter yet they dedicated a whole blog to bashing me and didn’t even tag me. Talk about cowardly. Clearly many of those people who hate me have comprehension problems. What’s ironic is how people preach about me or certain people needing “compassion” while they bash anyone who doesn’t think like them. Why don’t they practice what they preach first? Nothing pisses me off more when someone can’t talk directly to me and they gossip about me behind my back and I find it.
I don’t let their views of me get to me though because if I cared what those people thought of me, I would have stopped posting a long time ago.
@xinq - Oh, don’t flatter yourself. it wasn’t a whole blog, LOL.
@xinq - I didn’t respond to you HERE, because I’ve seen exactly how you respond to people on here. You say you are open minded, but you bash others for their opinions and act like your opinions are golden! I took my thoughts to MY OWN page. Get the fuck over it.
and if you really didn’t care what I think, You wouldn’t be commenting on it.
@Megabyyte - I’m not flattering myself hun, I’ve even been attacked here. Thank you I knew you were talking about me because I am the ONLY one who thought opposite in this blog. It’s not that hard to figure out that you were talking about me, no one else is really agreeing with everything I say. Nice try.
@xinq - What I meant was, don’t flatter yourself that I dedicated a WHOLE post to you. It was a mere section of a post, where I said other stuff too. lol… It wasn’t even so much about YOU, but about what you said and I’m pretty sure you’re not the only one in this world who thinks that way!
You said in a previous comment, “Does she not hold some blame?”
So you would then agree that you think she holds some responsibility in her rape and is at fault because of it? Yes?
I mean, hey, that’s your opinion, even though I think it’s shit. No, I don’t care if someone is blacked out drunk, YOU DON’T TOUCH THEM. The only one responsible, is the one who takes advantage of someone in that position.
But hey, using your logic… you want to put blame on someone who was raped, for being an idiot teen, well… maybe you wouldn’t be getting attacked here (or have so called “hate blogs” against you), if you didn’t leave such idiotic comments!
I guess you kinda asked for it, huh? 
@Lost__In_My_Mind - “She gets upset and cries rape. This kind of thing happens all too often. ” <- I’m not sure how often it happens, but I understand that it’s not outside the realm of what we, as humans, do and are capable of. Over the summer, a co-workers son was caught having sex with his girlfriend (I believe by one of the girl’s parents). They were both the same age (13 or 14). The girl got extremely embarrassed by her actions and told her parents that the boy forced her into having sex and that she never want to and actually told him “no”. She didn’t think the boy would get in trouble. But the girl’s parents filed a police report and the boy was being charged with rape. The girl eventually reversed her story a couple of months later and the charges were dropped. According to the boy, she actually pressured him into having sex, so he was pretty shocked when all this came about. No one believed the boy, except his father/mother.
A lot of emotions running high on the comments here. People are quick to hand out opinions of guilt (although that’s already been handed out by the courts) and punishment. I usually avoid these kind of posts, specifically because they ~never~ amount to anything resembling something along the lines of constructive conversation, debate, or such. A mob type mentally usually develops pretty quickly (I’m not referring to ~just~ here) and any kind of thought or comment that isn’t in tow. gets flak or backlash. I haven’t been on Xanga long, but I’m starting to see a trend with TheTheologiansCafe’s blog entries. Some of the comments here really disgust me though. Cut off their dicks or fingers? Put them to death? 10 years in prison?
I don’t know all the details of this event. The link in the original post didn’t provide any real info except the sentencing. I read a few other sites, got some info. Unless there’s something I’m missing, she’s ~definitely~ a victim of these boy’s actions. While they (the boys) are ultimately responsible for their actions (whether they were drunk or not. Yes, being drunk does change how you think, act, and make decisions; buy you made the choice to get drink in the first place. So you are still responsible for ~your~ actions while intoxicated.), their punishment will do ~nothing~ to correct why this originally happened in the first place. A year or so in jail (juvi no less)? Three years in jail? Pfft that’s nothing to compared to that they will be ‘registered sex offenders’ for the rest of their life. Their life ~is~ ruined; jail or no jail. And assuming they have a conscious (good people can and ~will~ do cruel things; not everybody that does a cruel thing is a monster at heart), they will have to live with this for the rest of their lives. These were boys, not men. These were ~all~ children, including the victim. And I don’t care if you’re close to 18 years old or are 18 years old, you’re still a fucking kid regardless of what the law says. We, as the adults in this society, failed them all. You can make the laws tougher, prosecute kids as adults, send people to jail longer, given them a second class citizen status, whatever… but ultimately you fixed nothing.
I don’t see just one victim in all of this; ultimately I see three victims from this sad story. What if she was your best friend, or your cousin, or your sister, or your daughter? What either of those boys were your best friend, or your cousin, or your bother, or your son?
@Grannys_Place - If the girl who was digitally “raped” remains in her small town maybe there might be a “lifetime” of grief. Even though the courts and the news by law is not supposed to publish the name of the victim because she is underage, the photos that got passed around will probably still float forever.
I don’t want to get into what types of rape survivors have it worse, unfortunately “jocks” have been getting away with “rape” sex and probably more coaches should start programs to tell Jocks that they should not do things just because they might get away with it.
There are a lot of “Damaged” women in this world and the victim of Steubenville will join the ranks. It stinks and a lot of help is needed for those women. The easiest thing to prevent damaged women is stop rape but basically other things like counseling and buddy systems should be in place.
I don’t think they should have been found guilty of rape because it seems to be pretty consensual to me….they were just youngsters who made a mistake (a thre of them were) and the female was no angel in this matter.
I would be interested to know how much drunkeness played into this: For instance, if she alone was drunk, if only the guys were drunk, or if all were drunk. Considering Alcohol impairs judgement and it is illegal for anyone under 21 anyways (weren’t they under 21?), wouldn’t anyone drunk in this situation bear some responsibility for the situation. Gah, and I know that sounds harsh and insensitive. I think they all need some counseling (separately of course). But if I stole a car and then it was filed with drugs. I might not be charged with possesion by arguing ignorance, but I did STEAL A CAR in the first place. Does the biggest wrong nullify the other wrongs and responsibility of all involved.
I know this is a situation of rape, but would these also be considerations in a case of assault or murder, especially if both people in the case were under the influence of drugs and/or alcohol.
Personally, it is questions like these why I do not drink and really why I do not like to be around other people who drink. I like to be aware of what is going on with and around me… and I like friends who are the same. they can drink, but if they are getting buzzed or drunk a lot, I just dont think a good friendship is going to happen there.
I am also wondering:
“They had sex with a 16-year-old girl who was drunk.” – Dan
http://www.ohio.com/news/break-news/2-steubenville-football-players-found-guilty-of-rape-1.382075
Was this something she did not want and said no to OR was she drunk and then later regretted what happened??? Ok ok, yes rape is wrong. It is terrifying and terrible! but also guys.. comon, dont have sex with girls who are drunk or crazy OR drunk and crazy (Not sayng the girl here was, but just in general… But Should anyone have to say that! Really!).
Side-note: I know in the ministry even an accusation or rape, sexual assault, or sexual harassment can have a guy fire (or resigned) instantly. There does not have to be proof, nor do they have to be proven guilty. No, just the accusation and appearance of wrong will end that job, if not his career.
I think to really make a judgement on something like this, one would have to know more about the case. I dont doubt the judge decided one year for a reason. He had to know the blow up and ramifications of his judgement once it got out… that or he is a moron
He could just be a moron, I can concede to that.
Now, since my comment is different than most others, I guess the axe will fall now. I may or may not reply. I dont like getting sucked into drama but just wanted to add my additional thought and pondering to the others. Yes, anyone who rapes should get a long sentence, one year is short… but I think we should be honest about what ALL went on here.
And I do agree that if these two boys were charged, those filming should also be charged!
TheoDam-’s blog is written in a way to incite. Even the picture has subtextual message that gets me riled at his sort of racist slant.
@specificallyrandom - I liked your attempt at constructive criticism. Yes it is getting way too rare here at xanga and the drama stuff is all the people who have been boiling over past injustices done here at xanga.
@xinq - You should just stay with constructive criticism and not take things too personal. Theo Dan’s blog is not the place to put up comments that can be taken in another fashion. What sort of impact do you want to do at xanga? Looks like you have solidified some positions but other positions you are discovering that it is like giving alcohol to the alcoholics.
You have potential with your own circles but basically you are discovering the way other circles here at xanga behave. I am guessing that you are not Christian and those are the ones (well the fundamentalist) who are well versed in their own universe. At times we see the sex prudes, they now want to have government in our private life. Sex in the United States is weird.
@specificallyrandom - Exactly the point I was trying to get across. These boys are also someone’s friends, relatives, and yes they committed a horrible crime but those close to them will also be affected. I don’t know if you noticed at datingish I have been the target of hate for a long time and it was not warranted at all. People misunderstood things and just started flaming me which is why I ignore half of them. I know there are many people who also understand where I’m coming from no matter what thought I make. I read that the girl even had a possible crush on one of the boys? Don’t know how true that is.
@PPhilip - I want to be fair to everyone involved in the case. Usually most rape cases are pretty open and shut, but sometimes it isn’t and I am looking at things from all angles. Like someone said, these boys may not have acted like that either had they not been drunk and everyone is at fault. What I don’t like is how people paint the girl to be so innocent. If she was truly innocent she wouldn’t have had to experience this in the first place right? Everyone is guilty of various crimes and at the end of the day, everyone involved doesn’t look good. All of the families are affected by it. I thought I said my opinion pretty fairly when I first posted, it was just a differing one and I got attacked as usual by the same people who’ve been attacking me on datingish nonetheless. I’ve been the target lately it feels like probably because I’m very blunt in the way I say things. Things like these shouldn’t be sugarcoated. I definitely did not want to do that to Dan’s blogs. Leave it to the people who insult me to get a rise out of me because they know how I’ll react.
@xinq - It is too easy to sum up what people are saying. I tend to believe a lot of folks are saying stuff with a forked tongue. Some folks want all rapists to be thrown in jail and the key thrown away regardless if one out of a thousand might be “innocent”.
Furthermore Theo Dan’s topic was not thoroughly vetted and it has the ulterior motive to be harsh. In personal communications Dan trots along the nice path in real life.
Good luck in your attempts to see stuff in a balanced way, unfortunately a lot of babies get thrown out with the bath water in these charged political times.
@xinq - Your analogy doesn’t make any sense. So if she is illegally parked she deserves to be gang raped? Because that is what you are saying, breaking the law makes it ok. She’s a kid. And most people on this post have ignored this is actually a case of rape of a kid. Your lack of compassion says nothing about her and everything about you.
@xinq - Just because she was being irresponsible does not mean she deserved to be raped.
@xinq - and if you were in that girl’s shoes, I wonder if you would be thinking the same. Or if you yourself accidentally got a too drunk, and woke up finding out you were raped, if your thinking would still be like this.
@xinq - No she shouldn’t have been drinking, but she did NOT DESERVE TO BE RAPED!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The only people responsible for her rape were the rapists themselves!!!!!!!!! Yeah everybody was drinking, but that doesn’t make it ok for them to rape her! It is a sad situation all around. Even if she did lie about where she was going, what the two guys did was terrible. I can’t stand when people say “she shouldn’t have done this, or that” WHAT THE FLIP????? THE RAPISTS SHOULDN’T HAVE RAPED HER!
T
@AngelAsh_86 - ur not too harsh. they need to pay for what they did
@xinq - I’m sorry to have to say this but you aren’t open minded. You are just vile.
I post this on my FB and I think its worth sharing here.
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/03/17/cnn-grieves-that-guilty-verdict-ruined-promising-lives-of-steubenville-rapists/
I don’t understand how people can sympathize with the rapist so much. The news clip did not even mention the girl that got raped. Is this how society thinks? Do others share the same view point?
WTH?!
@EmilyandAtticus - And your blog is friend locked. Looks like you discovered a new word to insult someone…vile:
Definition of VILE1 a : morally despicable or abhorrent b : physically repulsive : foul common; also : mean 3 : tending to degrade 4 : disgustingly or utterly bad : obnoxious, contemptible
——————————————————————————————————-
There is a purpose here at this particular blog subject? That the rape sentence was too short? Are you of the mode to get rid of all the rapists or getting “justice” for victims of rape? Oh wait most of the time we humans are complicated creatures and have to make a few compromises and exceptions.
I did blog on Megabyte’s position and yes there are true victims and then there are victims caught unexpectantly. I suppose the Steubenville victim did get rape both by physical and public humiliation. I have to hand to her credit for being brave enough to set the record straight that in no circumstances should rapists get away scott free.
I think xinq and a lot of folks want this episode also to be a lesson about the dangers of drinking. I myself emphasize that everyone should protect each other. The community of Steubenville failed in protecting someone who was in a position to be hurt. I think that you tried to hurt xinq by using that word….and you should rethink your position. No one should insult another person however pointing out specifically why you think an opinion is right or wrong is what we want to do here, and not get into personal insults.
@PPhilip - I didn’t discover a new word. I always knew that word. My blog is friends locked because I like it that way. I don’t care what anybody else thinks of it.
@PPhilip - I don’t care what she wants. She is a soulless creep and I am glad I don’t know her. If you are like her, then the same to you.
@xinq - and what if she had been 21 and drunk? What about the MILLIONS of women who are raped while sober? What about them? RAPE IS RAPE. No matter what. Period. End of story. It is always atrocious and NO ONE deserves to be raped NO MATTER HOW DRUNK THEY ARE OR HOW OLD THEY ARE. I bet there were a ton of boys drunk and passed out at that party and you wanna know how many of them were raped multiple times, kidnapped, and humiliated? Zero. Stop victim blaming. I am so disgusted I could vomit. People like you are why rape culture exists.
@Doubledb - To clarify a few things, she was drugged, raped, kidnapped, sexually assaulted, raped again, and then humiliated because they filmed all of this. She did not drunkenly have sex with them and then regret it later. They repeatedly raped her. Yet somehow EVERYONE IS STILL FEELING SORRY FOR THE !!!!RAPISTS!!!!!!!!. I don’t want to live on this planet anymore.
@EmilyandAtticus - Definitely there are some issues about xinq that I do not like. “I don’t care what anybody else thinks of it.” is not obvious but you are referring to your friend lock, but you are a caring person and do care about how people think on certain issues. Anyway are you more of a small town mentality or a big city mentality? I think xinq is of a big city mentality where people sort of are forced to look out for themselves. Passing laws certainly cannot protect people in actuality even though that is all big city folks tend to try. The young girl who was raped also had done drinking in another episode and thought the system robust enough not to be a problem. It is probably too late for her to rethink her idea that drinking underage would not be a problem. In a way maybe her parents also took it for granted that underage drinking is just another rite of passage, anyway the moral of the story is that drinking should be monitored more strongly than they used to do.Plus that guys should never take advantage of women or will be severely punished.
@PPhilip - You can lecture all you want. I still don’t care what you think of me or friends lock. And my view of people like her and you won’t change. Don’t waste your time on long comments that I won’t read.
@Ampersands_Anonymous - Moving the scenario to suit your argument? Let’s move to the scenario of human trafficing.MORE LIKELY MILLIONS OF WOMEN ARE KIDNAPPED AND TAKEN TO ANOTHER PLACE TO BE EXPLOITED AS PROSTITUTES. In America a certain number of women do not report rape because of the embarassment and power politics that favor the rapist over the victim. I WANT TO LIVE ON THIS PLANET TO STOP SUCH EXPLOITATION. No everyone is getting second thoughts,CNN apologized for taking the rapist point of view and it looks like the Steubenville episode is changing America. I see light on rape as a way to stop rape.
Please don’t vomit (that is a waste of good food). If you get more braver, help to teach and educate people more on how to respect each other and how to hope for a brighter future.
@specificallyrandom – it really does happen too often. Although in my opinion, all too often could be five times ever in history… The thing about false accusations is they take credibility from the actual victims. Which isn’t saying she lied. I was more or less trying to say that we can all sit here and point fingers all day long, but no one knows what actually happened in that courtroom except for the people who were there. I honestly believe that if the judge saw reason for harsher punishment, she would have given it. I understand why some people get so heated in the comments. Rape is a terrible, terrible thing, and too many people have experienced it.. But we have to look at this objectively. Kids. Drunk. Having sex. I did it, and I was super embarrassed. And then to see your naked picture circulating… I’m not saying she is lying, I honestly don’t know and won’t guess one way or another, but I am saying she had damn good reason to lie. Fear does stupid things to kids. Along with alcohol.
No matter what happened here, I hope justice was served one way or another.
Rape and at such a young age? One year is too short for these kids. They need a longer punishment and a sterner sentence or else it’s rape today and murder tomorrow.
I’ve never been actually drunk. Never passed out. Never raped or molested anyone, nor been raped. I have received unwanted sexual touching. Rape must truly be a terrible thing, but these guys didn’t actually rape her; its semantics, a case of legal semantics peculiar to that state. Even the FBI didn’t define such actions as “rape” until January 2012. Many other states and countries would not call digital penetration rape; it would be sexual assault, and in this case, not truly an assault, since she was unconscious with no memory of the events. Assault implies violation of a person’s wishes, so sexual battery, or inappropriate touching is the crime. Rape generally does some injury to the female since she isn’t receptive, but as far as I know this female wasn’t injured. Her injuries were being embarrassed for letting herself get drunk and manhandled by some inhumane people who were willing to treat her body disrespectfully as well as to commit some criminal sexual touching of an unconscious person. They didn’t have sex with her or rape her; if she was conscious and consenting it would be foreplay, not sex. If nonconsenting then it would have been sexual assault, not rape. The sentences were just. I would suppose that even most adults living in Ohio didn’t realize that digital penetration is considered rape, esp. on an unconscious person. What was done was a sexual offense, but far short of rape, which is an act of aggression and violence. That’s how I see it for now anyway.
Three lives were destroyed with this crime, not just one. The victim will have to live with the trauma of finding out she had been fingered when she was too drunk to remember. In addition, the two boys will miss out on high school, have no chance of college, and will be punished for the rest of their lives as registered sex offenders.
Even though they will be released from the juvenile system when they are 21, they will not have prosperous lives. I’d leave the country if I were them.
@EmilyandAtticus - She never said that being drunk justifies raping someone. Both parties are at fault. That girl shouldn’t have been drinking or spending time alone with them, and they should not have fondled her. There is a good chance that this was all consentual behavior brought on by impaired judgment from alcohol. Just because the girl said it was rape or that she does not remember does not make it so. A lot of girls get drunk and slutty and then cry rape to protect their honor.
@crgrier - few countries will take them. Who wants a sex offender
@FallenSafely - I think she probably has a lot more self respect than you do, and I’m very skeptical of her rape story. The fact is that after “having a few drinks” your judgment is impaired, so while you may not have been entirely coherent, that does not make the behavior non-consentual. Getting drunk is stupid. Getting drunk alone with members of the opposite gender is stupid, and getting drunk under age is stupid.
I refuse to get drunk because, aside from the fact that I don’t want to be addicted, and aside from the health considerations, I don’t trust other people. If you get drunk you might get raped, you might also get your kidneys stolen. That does not justify the actions of those people but it also does not exempt you from having any ownership of he consequences. Also, you have to consider that a lot of younger women will cry rape to protect their honor. I am very skeptical of rape accusations after alcohol has entered the equation.
http://www.cnn.com/2012/09/05/world/europe/turkey-rape-beheading <—this.
I think the kids needed to be charged as adults with a much LONGER sentence.
They deserved a LOT longer!!! They pretty much got away with the crime….
@Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex - I know what she said I can read. I answered her. Your asshole view that a rape victim is to blame means nothing to me don’t talk to me.
@EmilyandAtticus - I’m not so sure you can read. Where did I say that rape victims are to blame for rape? Do quote me.
@Texasjillcarmel - Right, because all men are responsible for that.
@Lives4Waffles - How does one accidentally get drunk?
@Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex - let’s say someone is drinking for the first time, or they don’t drink often so they don’t know their limit yet. They get way too drunk without meaning to. It’s happened to everyone.
@Lives4Waffles - Well let me put it to you this way. A huge part of the reason why I don’t drink is because I don’t trust the people around me. If I got stupid drunk, there is a chance that I might get fondled, raped, or have a kidney stolen. You cannot guarantee the good behavior of your neighbors, you can only do your best to prepare for their bad behavor.
Also, if you hang around people who are dirty and corrupt, you can’t be surprised when they do something dirty and corrupt. So it’s better not to go to bars, and if you want to drink it is better to drink alone and at home where no one can rape you or steal your organs.
I’m not convinced that this was rape either. They were drunk and she was drunk. When I went to a club once I got touched on by so many drunk women. I never did anything with them or touched them back because I’m in a relationship and I’m loyal. But given how there are so many women that will cry rape when they feel embarrassed about something they did, and how when they do the man is pretty much considered guilty until proven innocent I think doing anything with them at all would have been wrought with peril at an every point.
@Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex - She actually says it’s okay to rape someone as long as they commit a crime first. In this case, underage drinking. She said it multiple times. Try to justify it as much as you want with some skewed perception of what’s right and wrong, but rape is not acceptable in any form. If this girl blacked out and they had sex with her, that’s rape. If fondled her when she wasn’t completely or even slightly incoherent, that’s rape.
You can’t justify someone having sex with or inappropriately touching another person without that person having any control of the situation. It’s wrong, it’s fucked up, and it’s completely disgusting.
@Lithium98 - Don’t tell me what “she actually says” without producing a quote. Also, don’t put words in my mouth without producing an actual quote. If you are going to accuse me, or anyone else, of saying something then provide a quote.
“If fondled her when she wasn’t completely or even slightly incoherent, that’s rape.”–Did you mean to say coherent? I think you might want to look at what you are actually typing before you post.
Alcohol makes people do stupid things, and if you are going to say if a woman has sex while drunk, that she is by definition not in control and cannot be held accountable, then the same applies to the man who is having sex as well. He’s just not in control and can’t be held accountable by the same logic. If A = B and B = C, then A also = C.
@PPhilip - Nothing you just said made sense to me.
@Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex -
If you need any quotes, just read any of her previous comments. When I confronted her about said quotes, she chose not to explain herself. I can only assume she was comfortable with her statement that she didn’t feel the need to explain why she thinks rape is an acceptable punishment for anyone who commits a crime.
Oh sweet Jesus! A single typo! Thanks for understanding what I meant to say and not making that an unnecessary big deal. Pointing that out might have just shown how irrelevant it would’ve been.
Your logic is sound here, but that’s not what was proven to have happened. Yes, if all parties involved are not in control of their own actions, it’s hard to place blame, if there’s any to place at all. A judge found these guys guilty of rape. They are serving a sentence for committing the heinous crime of rape. THEY ARE GUILTY OF RAPE. It was brought to the conclusion that these guys were well aware of their actions. If they were not found guilty of rape, it would be a different story and your logic would apply.
Also, I left three typos for you to find in this response. Get them all and you win.
@xinq - @DougX831 - You two get a room. this is just like a few romantic comedies I have seen. It always ends with … ok not in the real world
@trunthepaige -
…
@Lithium98 - That is not how it works. If you are going to make an accusation about what someone said then it is up to you to provide proof to back up your claims. If you are unwilling or unable to back up your claims then you should retract them. As it happens I read the first page of her comments and saw nothing of the sort. So I put it to you again, where did she say that rape is an acceptable punishment for anyone who commits a crime?
Typically I would disregard typos, but typos do matter when the word you use is the antonym of the word you intended. Initially I was going to respond to the statement as stated, but upon further reflection I elected to pursue the possibility that it was a typo.
IF they truly are guilty of rape then they should be dealt with accordingly. But on the other hand all parties involved should be prosecuted for underage drinking as well, which is what Xing said in her initial comment “She was underage drinking and should be ticketed and fined as well.”
Do you object to that statement, and if so what is the logic behind your objection?
@Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex - Whoa buddy! Take a step back. What do you mean “IF they are truly guilty of rape”? THEY ARE GUILTY OF RAPE. That’s what this whole thing is about.
I’m gonna help you make your point. It’s gonna be very simple, especially for you.
1. Is rape an acceptable form of punishment for any crime?
2. Does anyone deserve to be raped?
3. Do you understand the definition of rape, if so, define it in your own words.
@Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex - I totally understand that and you are right. The girl in this story was known to lie, and drink heavily a lot. But I also heard that there were a lot of witnesses to what had happened. But anyways, I agree with what you are saying about drinking out in public with other people. You can’t trust everyone. But mistakes happen, such as what I said in my last comment to you, an inexperienced drinker getting too drunk. But even if the person wanted to get shit faced, I wouldn’t put all the blame on them or say they deserved it. I don’t think anyone deserves rape, and that’s what I was trying to say to the person I originally replied too. Not saying you’re saying that. I avoid discussions like this because they are triggering, but a few people rec’d that comment so I felt the need to reply to her. And yeah, it sucks that some women falsely report rape. It’s already hard enough to prove in court. I don’t know much about this case other than a few articles and based on what is in the media, I’m honestly not sure if she was really raped or not.
@Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex - and btw, sorry about my reply to you being all over the place, lol.
@Lithium98 - Are you on the same page as I am on? Instead of
1. Is rape an acceptable form of punishment for any crime? No it is not however the United States is evolving its punishment law and soon execution (the ultimate punishment) will be abolished. It was not too long ago that lynching was a sort of punishment for being black in the wrong place.
Basically your extreme example never ever was proposed. Unfortunately for a long time in India a lot of women got raped when reporting to authorities and in some muslim countries raped women often were murdered/executed.
Basically the twisting of xinq’s words is an attempt to witchhunt her. You are being complicit in telling your twisted interpretation of what she is saying.
If I were to complain to xanga, I would write a complaint about malicious lying and twisting of words to defame a person.
I though you were more responsible and not into mischief.
@Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex - I hope you know she was entirely KNOCKED out and the only way she found out she was raped was because they took pictures of them screwing her lifeless body and passed them around the entire school. So you’re little “she’s lying” ploy is a bunch of shit, go stick it where the sun don’t shine and learn some manners you stupid fuck. Why don’t you research your shit before you talk to me like that.
@Lithium98 - Before I answer any of your questions I want to see you answer mine.
@PPhilip - But it was proposed. When I asked for clarification, I heard nothing back from Xinq. Then Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex jumped in to defend Xinq’s point. I was merely replying to their comments directed at me. Never once have I judged either one of them, called them names, attacked them personally, or anything of the like. I haven’t twisted words and gave ample opportunity to listen to clarification of the point they were arguing. I don’t know either one of them personally and aside from clicking over to their site to make sure they aren’t trolls who just created their usernames to hassle people around here, I’ve never been to their site. I have no agenda as far as defaming them nor do I intend to do so.
Luckily for anyone interested, the comments are here for everyone to read. If you feel I’ve done enough wrong doing to report it to xanga staff, go for it. I’ll be here waiting for a response from Xinq and/or Ambrosius so we can actually get back to discussing the issue like adults.
@Lives4Waffles - Right, even if she did get stupid drunk she didn’t deserve to get raped. If they raped her they need to be punished. I think what xing was saying is that the law should come down on the girl as well for getting intoxicated. I would agree with her on that, and add that the parents who hosted the party should also get some of the blame, as should whoever supplied all those kids with alcohol. I haven’t read the original news article, but, unfortunately I tend to be skeptical about rape allegations when drinking and partying is concerned. I once had an X-girlfriend that cheated on me with some guy and tried to pass if off as rape for nearly a year. So many bad things could have happened as a result of that. The problem is these days people have no honor for the most part. There is probably more rape and false accusation of rape than ever before. When I have kids I will probably not let them go to parties, regardless of their gender.
@Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex - That’s where things get tricky. Correct me if I’m wrong, but aren’t bartenders supposed to cut people off when they’ve had too much? But they don’t. It’s also hard to regulate that kind of thing at house parties. Since there’s no law saying how much a person should drink, I don’t think the people who are assaulted while under the influence should be punished, but they should be counseled. Since this girl is underage, she should be punished for drinking under age. According to articles she has a reputation of drinking a lot, and she’s only 14! Hopefully she’s learned her lesson, though. That sucks about your past girlfriend, so I kind of understand where you’re coming from.
@Lithium98 - You clearly have no training in rhetoric and very little experience in debates. I think you must either have forgotten how things have transpired or you are blatantly lying in spite of all the comments being posted here:
“I was merely replying to their comments directed at me”–That is simply not true. I never directed any comment at you until you started talking to me. You can scroll through all of the pages to see all of my comments, and to whom they were directed.
“Never once have I judged either one of them, called them names, attacked them personally”–Also not true.”I’m gonna help you make your point. It’s gonna be very simple, especially for you”–That is a personal attack. Of course I don’t care if you, or any other left wing keyboard warrior wants to insult me, in truth I find the hatred I receive amusing, but the fact is you are either lying or you have a very short term memory if you think you have not attacked me personally. In your case I am going to assume it’s dishonesty, given what I have seen from your other comments. It is also worth noting that you are unjustifiably smug.
“I haven’t twisted words and gave ample opportunity to listen to clarification of the point they were arguing.”–To twist words you would have to at least quote someone, but in this case it would be better to say that you are putting words in our mouths. You have made some accusations, I asked you to back them up with quotes, you failed to do so.
@FallenSafely - As a matter of fact, I haven’t read the article, nor do I see a link posted in the entry. Most of what I know comes from the arguments and comments here, which I admit is next to nothing, hence my skepticism. But from what I have seen it looks like what they did was finger her, not actually have sex, although I could be wrong on that. If fingering someone of the opposite gender is rape then I could make a case against some women who touched on me. But I digress, feel free to provide me a link to the actual news article if you wish. Also, you aren’t in a position to lecture anyone on manners.
Why didn’t you read Xing’s comment before responding to her? You just blew a stack as if her comment was a personal attack on you, and began accusing her of saying things that she never actually said. You are very emotional, and not entirely civilized. As a result I would find it difficult to take your word on anything. You have a skewed view of reality which is not borne out by facts.
@Lives4Waffles - I’m not really sure. I have never gone to bars except to pick up friends, with one exception. I went to a club once to see Paul Van Dyk, and they had a bar in the club. My friends drank but I didn’t. I don’t take alcohol unless I’m engaging in a religious ceremony that requires it, like certain types of communion or Passover Saders. When I was at the club lots of people were drinking and I got touched on by so many girls, probably a lot of that touching was induced by alcohol, which causes impaired reasoning. I just went there for the music, but after having gone I got the distinct impression that a lot of people, of both genders, go there for an excuse to touch on members of the opposite gender without any commitment being involved. I didn’t touch back on any of the girls because I’m in a relationship and I’m loyal. But I can tell you one thing, when a guy gets touched on by an attractive woman, the natural instinct is to want to touch back. After having been there I decided that I’m not going to go back there until I can bring my girlfriend with me.
Anyways, I know that’s kind of a long personal anecdote, but I can’t help wondering how many men get accused of rape because the woman feels ashamed later on. Maybe if I had touched any of those women back I might have been accused of something. I guess it’s better not to drink, and better not to touch.
When I think of rape I think of things like the Delhi incident, or women getting pounced on when they go out at night and deflowered by some asshole. Indiscretions in the bar or in the club are typically gray areas, on both sides. When stuff like that gets overly trumped it it cheapens actual rape, which is tragic and ruins lives.
@Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex - Great job taking that first statement out of context. I did initiate the conversation with both of you. I was not attacking you, I was just responding to your comments. Again, anyone who is dissatisfied with that, can go back and read through the comments.
I did simplify things for you. You were having trouble getting your point across so broke it down to three questions for you to answer that would clarify your point. Did I call you simple or anything else, no.
Lastly, I do remember saying that the initial point you were defending was stated by Xing in all of her comments. She was thoroughly repeating herself. Here’s my response to her reply to my first comment:
@xinq - No one is saying she shouldn’t be punished for her underage drinking. Just because she was raped doesn’t mean the rules don’t apply to her as well. I understand you think everyone should be held accountable for their actions but when you say things like “no one forced her to drink”, you give off the impression that you feel her being raped is an acceptable punishment for having alcohol at a young age. This is why everyone is up in arms. Being raped is not an acceptable punishment at all for anything. We have a legal system that is to deal out the appropriate punishment for the crimes committed by any individual. That’s what everyone else is trying to say.
This is what you were defending at first and then lost track of your argument. I tried to simplify things to get a direct response from you and you veered off track completely. If you’d like to continue the actual discussion, I’m all for it. If not, that works for me too.
@Lithium98 - It is not out of context: ”But it was proposed. When I asked for clarification, I heard nothing back from Xinq. Then Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex jumped in to defend Xinq’s point. I was merely replying to their comments directed at me.”–If you read that statement and take it literally it does indicate that you were responding to us, which is inaccurate. If you mean something else then you should have typed it as such.
So incredibly wrong. I was making my points very clearly, and you consistently refused to respond to them. That comment you made had jack all to do with my comment, and was in fact a rabbit trail in order for you to avoid answering my questions.
What is the pertinence of this? I asked you to quote her where she claimed that rape as acceptable, not to tell me how you felt about her comments. Just because you got an impression does not mean that it was either justified or that it is the obvious conclusion. The obvious conclusion is to take her comments literally and at face value, without reading extra things into them.
No, you deliberately and consistenltly refused to defend the accusations and claims you were making. If you want me to answer your questions then you will answer mine first. Otherwise this isn’t going anywhere.
@Ambrosius_Augustus_Rex - You’re absolutely right I do get emotional when someone blames the victim. I believe her comment to me was something like “I refuse to play into this theory that the girl was a victim”. The girl is a victim though. Just because she got drunk doesn’t make her not a victim.
Tweets from one of the football players
“You don’t sleep through a wang in the butthole”. and “Some people deserve to be peed on”.
@Ampersands_Anonymous - you misunderstood me, I dont feel sorry for them… they should be punished, what I am saying is that there is much more going on here that should be dealt with: For Example: The Hook-Up culture in our country I think helps breed the thinking that such things are ok. They are not. People were trying to cover this up because they were football players. Those filming will not be held accountable. And, where did all these kids get drugs, alcohol, and a private home with no parents??? I think this is more a systemic issue and only punishing the boys and using them as scapegoats (alone) does not solve anything in the long run (Yes, in this case but does it help produce deeper changes and accountability?) The article below explains it better than me. I usually dont edit my comments, but I tried re-editing my previous comment multiple times, not thinking I really said what I meant. I hope this clarifies what I meant somewhat better: I do appreciate your feedback/reply.
http://www.redletterchristians.org/five-questions-from-the-steubenville-rape-case/
p.s. – even if your not religious, I think some of his points are valid.
@Doubledb - the boys were not used as scapegoats though because they raped a girl…so they’re rapists.
@Ampersands_Anonymous - now my comment is better, when I edit out the word scapegoat!
you misunderstood me, I dont feel sorry
for them… they should be punished, what I am saying is that there is
much more going on here that should be dealt with: For Example: The
Hook-Up culture in our country I think helps breed the thinking that
such things are ok. They are not. People were trying to cover this up
because they were football players. Those filming will not be held
accountable. And, where did all these kids get drugs, alcohol, and a
private home with no parents??? I think this is more a systemic issue
and only punishing the boys does
not solve anything in the long run (Yes, in this case but does it help
produce deeper changes and accountability?) The article below explains
it better than me. I usually dont edit my comments, but I tried
re-editing my previous comment multiple times, not thinking I really
said what I meant. I hope this clarifies what I meant somewhat better: I
do appreciate your feedback/reply.
http://www.redletterchristians.org/five-questions-from-the-steubenville-rape-case/
p.s. – even if your not religious, I think some of his points are valid.
i know nothing of this case. but if a rape did occur, no. one year is not enough. if someone is beyond a doubt proven guilty of rape, i am all for the death penalty.
I don’t think so but A.) They were juveniles B.) In this country rapists are almost never punished as severely as they aught to be.